Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark

Started Jan 18, 2013 | Questions
coder01
Junior MemberPosts: 33
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Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
Jan 18, 2013

I have adjusted monitor settings to canon's recommendations to make up for the very white white of a computer monitor, and turned down the brightness.

I do not own a monitor calibration device.

What does not make sense to me is that with the brightness turned down and allowing photoshop elements to do a smart fix, it chooses color and brightness, wouldn't one expect that output to be good ?

Photoshop is not taking monitor settings into account when it does an automated smart fix does it ?

Even after a automated color and brightness adjustment I still always increase brightness of the print to 30 in photoshops settings, so image looks brighter than I would want.

Image still on dark side , varying from slight but acceptable to needing to reprint.

Any ideas on this , thanks for your help.

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TomHJ
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to coder01, Jan 18, 2013

1)   Without monitor calibration, what you think of as turning the brightness down may not be sufficient.  Monitor brightness for photo printing is a lot less than you might be used to!  Are your results different from a prior printer?

2)   I may be wrong, but it sounds as though you aren't using printer/paper-specific ICC profiles.  To do so, have Photoshop control the color management, with the correct ICC profile (your printer comes with ones for Canon papers; most third-party papers provide ones that are specific to your printer).  Then--equally important!--in your Pro-100 properties, turn off color management (via Main--Color Intensity--Manual--Matching--None).

I have the Pixma Pro 100, and my prints are, consistently, very close to what I expect them to be, based on the monitor (with or without "soft proofing").  I use Lightroom, but believe the Photoshop adjustments should be essentially the same.

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coder01
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to TomHJ, Jan 18, 2013

TomHJ wrote:

1) Without monitor calibration, what you think of as turning the brightness down may not be sufficient. Monitor brightness for photo printing is a lot less than you might be used to! Are your results different from a prior printer?

2) I may be wrong, but it sounds as though you aren't using printer/paper-specific ICC profiles. To do so, have Photoshop control the color management, with the correct ICC profile (your printer comes with ones for Canon papers; most third-party papers provide ones that are specific to your printer). Then--equally important!--in your Pro-100 properties, turn off color management (via Main--Color Intensity--Manual--Matching--None).

I have the Pixma Pro 100, and my prints are, consistently, very close to what I expect them to be, based on the monitor (with or without "soft proofing"). I use Lightroom, but believe the Photoshop adjustments should be essentially the same.

Tom,

Thanks for the suggestions.

Actually I am printing on Red River paper thus far and I use all of their corresponding ICC profiles. I have been very careful with that, to choose the correct ones.

I "think" the printer control is shut off. I followed directions whereby when I go to print I check the color settings (on a mac) and they are all gray , i.e. no changes allowed) which supposedly indicates that the printer controls are disabled.

I have not actually gone into the Pro-100 properties and turned off the color management as my understanding is photoshop elements is turning it off with the steps I follow. However, I may be wrong with that and will try that step next time I print.

What confuses me however is on test prints where I allow photoshop to adjust the photo to what it thinks is ideal and then it is controlling the printing, shouldnt the picture look fine ? Photoshops automatic controls are not dependent on what the monitor is showing are they ?

My last printer was by no means a photo printer so I have nothing to compare. This is my first venture into printing large images myself. Perhaps I will have to cave and purchase a calibration device. I am trying to avoid that.

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Vernon D Rainwater
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to coder01, Jan 18, 2013

coder01 wrote:

TomHJ wrote:

1) Without monitor calibration, what you think of as turning the brightness down may not be sufficient. Monitor brightness for photo printing is a lot less than you might be used to! Are your results different from a prior printer?

2) I may be wrong, but it sounds as though you aren't using printer/paper-specific ICC profiles. To do so, have Photoshop control the color management, with the correct ICC profile (your printer comes with ones for Canon papers; most third-party papers provide ones that are specific to your printer). Then--equally important!--in your Pro-100 properties, turn off color management (via Main--Color Intensity--Manual--Matching--None).

I have the Pixma Pro 100, and my prints are, consistently, very close to what I expect them to be, based on the monitor (with or without "soft proofing"). I use Lightroom, but believe the Photoshop adjustments should be essentially the same.

Tom,

Thanks for the suggestions.

Actually I am printing on Red River paper thus far and I use all of their corresponding ICC profiles. I have been very careful with that, to choose the correct ones.

I "think" the printer control is shut off. I followed directions whereby when I go to print I check the color settings (on a mac) and they are all gray , i.e. no changes allowed) which supposedly indicates that the printer controls are disabled.

I have not actually gone into the Pro-100 properties and turned off the color management as my understanding is photoshop elements is turning it off with the steps I follow. However, I may be wrong with that and will try that step next time I print.

What confuses me however is on test prints where I allow photoshop to adjust the photo to what it thinks is ideal and then it is controlling the printing, shouldnt the picture look fine ? Photoshops automatic controls are not dependent on what the monitor is showing are they ?

My last printer was by no means a photo printer so I have nothing to compare. This is my first venture into printing large images myself. Perhaps I will have to cave and purchase a calibration device. I am trying to avoid that.

Being certain that you are not double profiling, using (RR) Red River Papers with matching Profiles should produce excellent images.  I have had (not even one issue) by following this method.  Most of my RR printing is using 17x25 Polar Matte on the 3880 with excellent results.

I have two of their sample paper packs but have not finished testing with each type in the packs.

-- hide signature --

Vernon...

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Akin Koksal
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to coder01, Jan 18, 2013

coder01 wrote:

I have adjusted monitor settings to canon's recommendations to make up for the very white white of a computer monitor, and turned down the brightness.

I do not own a monitor calibration device.

What does not make sense to me is that with the brightness turned down and allowing photoshop elements to do a smart fix, it chooses color and brightness, wouldn't one expect that output to be good ?

Photoshop is not taking monitor settings into account when it does an automated smart fix does it ?

Even after a automated color and brightness adjustment I still always increase brightness of the print to 30 in photoshops settings, so image looks brighter than I would want.

Image still on dark side , varying from slight but acceptable to needing to reprint.

Any ideas on this , thanks for your help.

Your first step should be reading to understand color management and color spaces. Search for "sRGB" and you'll find extremely valuable information in this forum.

Second, you need to accept the fact that properly calibrating your monitor(s) is a requirement if you are interested in getting acceptable prints from your post-processed pictures.

By-passing this is just going to frustrate you... There has been numerous posts like yours here, most of them ended up happily right after OPs purchased a monitor calibration tool.

Once you have your monitors calibrated, your next step will be to master (understand) the use of ICC profiles specifically built for your printer/ink/paper combinations. You can either get these form paper manufacturers (for a given printer and its OEM ink), or built them by yourself.

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jtoolman
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to coder01, Jan 18, 2013

coder01 wrote:

TomHJ wrote:

1) Without monitor calibration, what you think of as turning the brightness down may not be sufficient. Monitor brightness for photo printing is a lot less than you might be used to! Are your results different from a prior printer?

2) I may be wrong, but it sounds as though you aren't using printer/paper-specific ICC profiles. To do so, have Photoshop control the color management, with the correct ICC profile (your printer comes with ones for Canon papers; most third-party papers provide ones that are specific to your printer). Then--equally important!--in your Pro-100 properties, turn off color management (via Main--Color Intensity--Manual--Matching--None).

I have the Pixma Pro 100, and my prints are, consistently, very close to what I expect them to be, based on the monitor (with or without "soft proofing"). I use Lightroom, but believe the Photoshop adjustments should be essentially the same.

Tom,

Thanks for the suggestions.

Actually I am printing on Red River paper thus far and I use all of their corresponding ICC profiles. I have been very careful with that, to choose the correct ones.

I "think" the printer control is shut off. I followed directions whereby when I go to print I check the color settings (on a mac) and they are all gray , i.e. no changes allowed) which supposedly indicates that the printer controls are disabled.

I have not actually gone into the Pro-100 properties and turned off the color management as my understanding is photoshop elements is turning it off with the steps I follow. However, I may be wrong with that and will try that step next time I print.

What confuses me however is on test prints where I allow photoshop to adjust the photo to what it thinks is ideal and then it is controlling the printing, shouldnt the picture look fine ? Photoshops automatic controls are not dependent on what the monitor is showing are they ?

My last printer was by no means a photo printer so I have nothing to compare. This is my first venture into printing large images myself. Perhaps I will have to cave and purchase a calibration device. I am trying to avoid that.

I don't know about MAC but in Windows, there is no such thing as Photoshop CSx or Elements being able to turn off color management automatically in the printer driver. You must do this by hand!

You PRO100 prints should be BRILLIANT!!!! Anything less and you are doing something wrong along the line.

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jtoolman
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to Vernon D Rainwater, Jan 18, 2013

Vernon D Rainwater wrote:

coder01 wrote:

TomHJ wrote:

1) Without monitor calibration, what you think of as turning the brightness down may not be sufficient. Monitor brightness for photo printing is a lot less than you might be used to! Are your results different from a prior printer?

2) I may be wrong, but it sounds as though you aren't using printer/paper-specific ICC profiles. To do so, have Photoshop control the color management, with the correct ICC profile (your printer comes with ones for Canon papers; most third-party papers provide ones that are specific to your printer). Then--equally important!--in your Pro-100 properties, turn off color management (via Main--Color Intensity--Manual--Matching--None).

I have the Pixma Pro 100, and my prints are, consistently, very close to what I expect them to be, based on the monitor (with or without "soft proofing"). I use Lightroom, but believe the Photoshop adjustments should be essentially the same.

Tom,

Thanks for the suggestions.

Actually I am printing on Red River paper thus far and I use all of their corresponding ICC profiles. I have been very careful with that, to choose the correct ones.

I "think" the printer control is shut off. I followed directions whereby when I go to print I check the color settings (on a mac) and they are all gray , i.e. no changes allowed) which supposedly indicates that the printer controls are disabled.

I have not actually gone into the Pro-100 properties and turned off the color management as my understanding is photoshop elements is turning it off with the steps I follow. However, I may be wrong with that and will try that step next time I print.

What confuses me however is on test prints where I allow photoshop to adjust the photo to what it thinks is ideal and then it is controlling the printing, shouldnt the picture look fine ? Photoshops automatic controls are not dependent on what the monitor is showing are they ?

My last printer was by no means a photo printer so I have nothing to compare. This is my first venture into printing large images myself. Perhaps I will have to cave and purchase a calibration device. I am trying to avoid that.

Being certain that you are not double profiling, using (RR) Red River Papers with matching Profiles should produce excellent images. I have had (not even one issue) by following this method. Most of my RR printing is using 17x25 Polar Matte on the 3880 with excellent results.

I have two of their sample paper packs but have not finished testing with each type in the packs.

-- hide signature --

Vernon...

I am betting on Double Profiling!

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TomHJ
Regular MemberPosts: 158
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to jtoolman, Jan 18, 2013

If you haven't gone into your Pixma Pro-100 printer driver properties and set "Matching" to "None" (at least, that is what it is on Windows, I assume it is similar on a Mac), you are almost certainly double-profiling.  I use Lightroom, and it does not turn off the printer-made adjustments itself.  (By the way, I use several Red River papers, and am very happy with their supplied ICCs.)  If the prints still appear too dark, you almost certainly need to profile your monitor (or at least turn brightness down).  Good luck--you have a terrific printer!

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grampaeddy
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to coder01, Jan 18, 2013

Having owned several canon printers, the paper type (matte or glossy) and brand will drive you wild. Pick one brand, calibrate best you can, then cut big sheets to 4x6's and run test prints. The old saying "one test is worth a thousand opinions" will save your sanity.

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intensity studios
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you should own a calibration device
In reply to coder01, Jan 19, 2013

coder01 wrote:

I have adjusted monitor settings to canon's recommendations to make up for the very white white of a computer monitor, and turned down the brightness.

I do not own a monitor calibration device.

What does not make sense to me is that with the brightness turned down and allowing photoshop elements to do a smart fix, it chooses color and brightness, wouldn't one expect that output to be good ?

Photoshop is not taking monitor settings into account when it does an automated smart fix does it ?

Even after a automated color and brightness adjustment I still always increase brightness of the print to 30 in photoshops settings, so image looks brighter than I would want.

Image still on dark side , varying from slight but acceptable to needing to reprint.

Any ideas on this , thanks for your help.

this is the most important piece of gear you can own aside from your camera.

-- hide signature --
 intensity studios's gear list:intensity studios's gear list
Nikon D3200 Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G VR Nikon AF-S Nikkor 50mm f/1.8G Canon Pixma Pro9000 Mark II Adobe Photoshop CS6 +4 more
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penns
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to coder01, Feb 20, 2013

I'm having the same problem with dark prints.  I'm rather new at this.  Set up the printer tonight and printed on hp glossy to start with.  Wasn't happy with the prints, but haven't bought a supply of Canon paper yet.  Opened the free sample of Canon Luster and printed a couple of pics.  The prints are dark--not vivid as I expected--compared to the ones printed on an hp 1300 series printer (about 4 years old--used 5 colors plus black).  I'm not comparing the prints to my monitor, although they do seem brighter there,too.  I don't have any special software, just trying to use Canon Easy Photo Print.  So, Canon paper, Canon ink, Canon software, what am I doing wrong?

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jtoolman
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to penns, Feb 20, 2013

penns wrote:

I'm having the same problem with dark prints. I'm rather new at this. Set up the printer tonight and printed on hp glossy to start with. Wasn't happy with the prints, but haven't bought a supply of Canon paper yet. Opened the free sample of Canon Luster and printed a couple of pics. The prints are dark--not vivid as I expected--compared to the ones printed on an hp 1300 series printer (about 4 years old--used 5 colors plus black). I'm not comparing the prints to my monitor, although they do seem brighter there,too. I don't have any special software, just trying to use Canon Easy Photo Print. So, Canon paper, Canon ink, Canon software, what am I doing wrong?

The ultimate trick to see if a printer is working properly is to print a test image

Here are a couple of them

http://www.normankoren.com/printer_calibration.html

Print them from your Canon Easy Photo Print making sure you choose the correct paper type. Do not edit these images. After printing, look at them and they should "LooK" correct to you. If they do not, you set up is probably wrong.

Everybody gets dark prints initially. Look it up in the search engine. The same question gets asked almost daily!

You monitor and probably every uncalibrated monitor out there is set TOO BRIGHT for photography.

So when the printer prints the image which is viewed by reflective light and you compare it to the monitor which work via transmitted light will os course look brighter and more colorful.

Your Pixma PRO-100 should print gorgeous prints. If it does not, I guarantee it is something you are simply not setting up correctly.

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penns
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to jtoolman, Feb 21, 2013

jtoolman wrote:

penns wrote:

I'm having the same problem with dark prints. I'm rather new at this. Set up the printer tonight and printed on hp glossy to start with. Wasn't happy with the prints, but haven't bought a supply of Canon paper yet. Opened the free sample of Canon Luster and printed a couple of pics. The prints are dark--not vivid as I expected--compared to the ones printed on an hp 1300 series printer (about 4 years old--used 5 colors plus black). I'm not comparing the prints to my monitor, although they do seem brighter there,too. I don't have any special software, just trying to use Canon Easy Photo Print. So, Canon paper, Canon ink, Canon software, what am I doing wrong?

The ultimate trick to see if a printer is working properly is to print a test image

Here are a couple of them

http://www.normankoren.com/printer_calibration.html

Print them from your Canon Easy Photo Print making sure you choose the correct paper type. Do not edit these images. After printing, look at them and they should "LooK" correct to you. If they do not, you set up is probably wrong.

Everybody gets dark prints initially. Look it up in the search engine. The same question gets asked almost daily!

You monitor and probably every uncalibrated monitor out there is set TOO BRIGHT for photography.

So when the printer prints the image which is viewed by reflective light and you compare it to the monitor which work via transmitted light will os course look brighter and more colorful.

Your Pixma PRO-100 should print gorgeous prints. If it does not, I guarantee it is something you are simply not setting up correctly.

My monitor may need to be calibrated, but I am not comparing the prints with the monitor.  I have not adjusted the prints with software--just printed them as the camera took them.  The prints I was getting from the hp 1300 were great and when I compare these I am disappointed.  I know this is a great printer, I just don't know what settings may be different.  In both cases, the prints are not adjusted or changed because of the monitor.

Joe, can I send you a file to check?

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jtoolman
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to penns, Feb 21, 2013

penns wrote:

jtoolman wrote:

penns wrote:

I'm having the same problem with dark prints. I'm rather new at this. Set up the printer tonight and printed on hp glossy to start with. Wasn't happy with the prints, but haven't bought a supply of Canon paper yet. Opened the free sample of Canon Luster and printed a couple of pics. The prints are dark--not vivid as I expected--compared to the ones printed on an hp 1300 series printer (about 4 years old--used 5 colors plus black). I'm not comparing the prints to my monitor, although they do seem brighter there,too. I don't have any special software, just trying to use Canon Easy Photo Print. So, Canon paper, Canon ink, Canon software, what am I doing wrong?

The ultimate trick to see if a printer is working properly is to print a test image

Here are a couple of them

http://www.normankoren.com/printer_calibration.html

Print them from your Canon Easy Photo Print making sure you choose the correct paper type. Do not edit these images. After printing, look at them and they should "LooK" correct to you. If they do not, you set up is probably wrong.

Everybody gets dark prints initially. Look it up in the search engine. The same question gets asked almost daily!

You monitor and probably every uncalibrated monitor out there is set TOO BRIGHT for photography.

So when the printer prints the image which is viewed by reflective light and you compare it to the monitor which work via transmitted light will os course look brighter and more colorful.

Your Pixma PRO-100 should print gorgeous prints. If it does not, I guarantee it is something you are simply not setting up correctly.

My monitor may need to be calibrated, but I am not comparing the prints with the monitor. I have not adjusted the prints with software--just printed them as the camera took them. The prints I was getting from the hp 1300 were great and when I compare these I am disappointed. I know this is a great printer, I just don't know what settings may be different. In both cases, the prints are not adjusted or changed because of the monitor.

Joe, can I send you a file to check?

Sure. No problem.

Joe

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penns
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to jtoolman, Feb 23, 2013

Joe, sent a pic to the email above.  Thanks!

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jtoolman
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to penns, Feb 24, 2013

penns wrote:

Joe, sent a pic to the email above. Thanks!

Penns,

I did get it but have not a chance to do anything with anything as I've working on my laptop which needed to be toorn apart and rebuilt. Finally got everything back in, some parts replaced and OS installed.

However I did take a quick look before all hell broke loose and the image looked fine on, editing machine. Did you want me to print it?

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penns
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to jtoolman, Feb 24, 2013

You don't really have to print it if you can tell what it looks like.  When I print it on Glossy II the sky is dark, almost ominous.  The buildings don't show the darkness as much, but if I look close they are darker what I think they should be.  If it looks good to you, where do I begin with trying to figure out how to check the settings?  What settings do I check first?   I really appreciate your help.

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jtoolman
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to penns, Feb 24, 2013

penns wrote:

You don't really have to print it if you can tell what it looks like. When I print it on Glossy II the sky is dark, almost ominous. The buildings don't show the darkness as much, but if I look close they are darker what I think they should be. If it looks good to you, where do I begin with trying to figure out how to check the settings? What settings do I check first? I really appreciate your help.

Well I just downloaded it and oppened on my laptop. It looks pretty bright and what I would call, normal. The sky is bright cyan and the buildings have nice open shadow details and nice color.

I printed a small 4x6 on epson ultra glossy using Qimage and printing through the matching ICC profile to my Epson Artisan 720. results pretty much matched the screen even though I just reinstalled everything on my laptop and have not yet calibrated the monitor with the colormunki, it does not match perfectly in color. However, the overall image is not at all dark with an omminous sky as you describe. The print matches the monitor as far as birghtness.

I've heard that the PRO-1 works best using the printer's own easy print plugin through Photoshop.

Other than that I have to direct experience with the PRO-1 but I do have a PRO 9500 and 9000 MKII and I mostly print through both of them through the plug in in PS.

Joe

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Pete4
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to jtoolman, Feb 24, 2013

If I may add my 5 cents:

Have you printed pictures from another program, for example windows viewer?

I would also disable color profiling (print/options/color management), since often color profile is applied inside PS and printer driver itself at the same time, making it all wrong.  I had struggled with that issue on my printer before.

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penns
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Re: Pixma Pro 100 prints are too dark
In reply to Pete4, Feb 26, 2013

Pete4 wrote:

If I may add my 5 cents:

Have you printed pictures from another program, for example windows viewer?

I would also disable color profiling (print/options/color management), since often color profile is applied inside PS and printer driver itself at the same time, making it all wrong. I had struggled with that issue on my printer before.

I am printing from windows viewer.  I do not have print shop.  There is no option to turn off color managemant, probably because I don't have PS.  I will be giving Canon a call soon.

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