Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photographic world

Started Sep 6, 2012 | Discussions
Kendall Helmstetter Gelner
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to Jaelkay, Sep 8, 2012

Jaelkay wrote:

If you're experiencing problems with speed, you cannot possibly have been using the camera.

I have said repeatedly the write times are slow and the battery life is low.

The write times do not matter much though while you are shooting.

Kendall, aka George Preddy, has said so.

That's really amusing coming from you, who once flubbed your alt post so bad you had to abandon it altogether.

Unlike the detractors I use my real name, from here to Flickr to elsewhere. I don't need to be anyone else, because I'm happy enough being me I have no desire to be anyone else - a lesson you could learn from.

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PrebenR
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to Jaelkay, Sep 8, 2012

Jaelkay wrote:

Eddy Teddy wrote:

I have the DP2 Merrill on loan; the images are very nice, truly amazing - better than the other cameras I have at hand; Sony Rx-100, Samsung Ex1 and Canon EOS 20D. I think performance is ok, but RAW writing is slow. But... Battery life time is weak... I have a very early production model; might be better now. Could anybody give us some numbers on battery life time?

If you're experiencing problems with speed, you cannot possibly have been using the camera. Kendall, aka George Preddy, has said so.

I have had no problem with the speed. The DP1 is far worse as one cannot take a photo while writing. With the Dp2M one can change settings and take new photos while the old is written to the card.

But Jaelkay, which other camera writes 45 to 60Mb faster to SD card ?

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AF takes away the Zen in photography

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marcio_napoli
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thanks KM !
In reply to Jaelkay, Sep 8, 2012

WOW!!

Thanks a lot, KM Legacy !!

I didn't know that dealer, all previous ads I've seen around here were from importers from Brazil's "version" of e-bay.

But that's great news for me! Thanks !

Now I just have to save, save, save... x1000, and then save again for it.

Thanks again !

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SandyF
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to PrebenR, Sep 8, 2012

PrebenR wrote:

Jaelkay wrote:

Eddy Teddy wrote:

I have the DP2 Merrill on loan; the images are very nice, truly amazing - better than the other cameras I have at hand; Sony Rx-100, Samsung Ex1 and Canon EOS 20D. I think performance is ok, but RAW writing is slow. But... Battery life time is weak... I have a very early production model; might be better now. Could anybody give us some numbers on battery life time?

If you're experiencing problems with speed, you cannot possibly have been using the camera. Kendall, aka George Preddy, has said so.

I have had no problem with the speed. The DP1 is far worse as one cannot take a photo while writing. With the Dp2M one can change settings and take new photos while the old is written to the card.

But Jaelkay, which other camera writes 45 to 60Mb faster to SD card ?

Right, you can take more photos with the DP2Merrill while it's writing... unlike the DP1. I'm getting many files around or over 60MB.

But Jaelkay claims to have the DP2Merrill in a post above, perhaps he hasn't discovered that you can shoot 'til the buffer fills... even if the light is blinking... ie you don't have to wait 'til the light stops blinking, Jaelkay.....
Best regards, Sandy
http://www.pbase.com/sandyfleischman (archival)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sandyfleischmann (current, new DP2Merrill photos)

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Laurence Matson
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From the same people, who brought you . . .
In reply to mroy, Sep 9, 2012

Schleimmheiliger, Hahnenburger, Spazifizieren, etc.

And, of course, they sound funny. Just wait a few years. At least it is not fooden, weekended, etc.

Schubladesieren means to put in a draw and fugitit.

It certainly has nothing to do with thinking.

L

mroy wrote:

Schubladesieren is what we call it in German.

In German it's actually 'Schubladendenken' - in English: 'thinking (?) in stereotypes'.

Schubladisieren seems to be more common in Austria or Helvetia - for a German it sounds funny.

Doesn't have anything to do with Denken / thinking, though!

Apart from that: I fully agree with you.

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Laurence
laurence at appledore-farm dot com

Sometimes, life is going to hit you with a brick. Don't lose faith.
Steve Jobs

http://www.pbase.com/lmatson
http://www.pbase.com/sigmadslr
http://www.howardmyerslaw.com

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Jaelkay
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to PrebenR, Sep 9, 2012

PrebenR wrote:

Jaelkay wrote:

Eddy Teddy wrote:

I have the DP2 Merrill on loan; the images are very nice, truly amazing - better than the other cameras I have at hand; Sony Rx-100, Samsung Ex1 and Canon EOS 20D. I think performance is ok, but RAW writing is slow. But... Battery life time is weak... I have a very early production model; might be better now. Could anybody give us some numbers on battery life time?

If you're experiencing problems with speed, you cannot possibly have been using the camera. Kendall, aka George Preddy, has said so.

I have had no problem with the speed. The DP1 is far worse as one cannot take a photo while writing. With the Dp2M one can change settings and take new photos while the old is written to the card.

But Jaelkay, which other camera writes 45 to 60Mb faster to SD card ?

Nikon D800E writes 75mb files to card all but instantly. Sorry 'bout that.

-- hide signature --

AF takes away the Zen in photography

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Jaelkay
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to SandyF, Sep 9, 2012

SandyF wrote:

PrebenR wrote:

Jaelkay wrote:

Eddy Teddy wrote:

I have the DP2 Merrill on loan; the images are very nice, truly amazing - better than the other cameras I have at hand; Sony Rx-100, Samsung Ex1 and Canon EOS 20D. I think performance is ok, but RAW writing is slow. But... Battery life time is weak... I have a very early production model; might be better now. Could anybody give us some numbers on battery life time?

If you're experiencing problems with speed, you cannot possibly have been using the camera. Kendall, aka George Preddy, has said so.

I have had no problem with the speed. The DP1 is far worse as one cannot take a photo while writing. With the Dp2M one can change settings and take new photos while the old is written to the card.

But Jaelkay, which other camera writes 45 to 60Mb faster to SD card ?

Right, you can take more photos with the DP2Merrill while it's writing... unlike the DP1. I'm getting many files around or over 60MB.

But Jaelkay claims to have the DP2Merrill in a post above, perhaps he hasn't discovered that you can shoot 'til the buffer fills...

NSS???? And when the buffer is full? What then, Sherlock? Does one have to wait for a dreadfully long time or not? Huh?

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KM Legacy
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Re: thanks KM !
In reply to marcio_napoli, Sep 9, 2012

You'll have to go to the distributor (or its website) to find an actual retail dealer. Distributors usually don't sell direct.

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victorgv
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to Jaelkay, Sep 9, 2012

I am kind of tired people complaining about Sigma DP series and compairing it with begemoth.
1. Sigma first on the market with foveon.
2. Sigma first with large sensor in compact body.

3. Comparision with D800 is ridicuolus one weight 1000g without glass and cost 3000 without glass, dp2m 355g with glass and cost 1000.
Just my 2 cents.

P.S. I wish i could by d800 but to expensive and would sit on shelf in my house - too big. Goes for other dslrs too..

Jaelkay wrote:

PrebenR wrote:

Jaelkay wrote:

Eddy Teddy wrote:

I have the DP2 Merrill on loan; the images are very nice, truly amazing - better than the other cameras I have at hand; Sony Rx-100, Samsung Ex1 and Canon EOS 20D. I think performance is ok, but RAW writing is slow. But... Battery life time is weak... I have a very early production model; might be better now. Could anybody give us some numbers on battery life time?

If you're experiencing problems with speed, you cannot possibly have been using the camera. Kendall, aka George Preddy, has said so.

I have had no problem with the speed. The DP1 is far worse as one cannot take a photo while writing. With the Dp2M one can change settings and take new photos while the old is written to the card.

But Jaelkay, which other camera writes 45 to 60Mb faster to SD card ?

Nikon D800E writes 75mb files to card all but instantly. Sorry 'bout that.

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AF takes away the Zen in photography

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flektogon
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to victorgv, Sep 9, 2012

victorgv wrote:

I am kind of tired people complaining about Sigma DP series and compairing it with begemoth.
1. Sigma first on the market with foveon.
2. Sigma first with large sensor in compact body.

3. Comparision with D800 is ridicuolus one weight 1000g without glass and cost 3000 without glass, dp2m 355g with glass and cost 1000.
Just my 2 cents.

P.S. I wish i could by d800 but to expensive and would sit on shelf in my house - too big. Goes for other dslrs too..

Jaelkay wrote:

PrebenR wrote:

Jaelkay wrote:

Eddy Teddy wrote:

I have the DP2 Merrill on loan; the images are very nice, truly amazing - better than the other cameras I have at hand; Sony Rx-100, Samsung Ex1 and Canon EOS 20D. I think performance is ok, but RAW writing is slow. But... Battery life time is weak... I have a very early production model; might be better now. Could anybody give us some numbers on battery life time?

If you're experiencing problems with speed, you cannot possibly have been using the camera. Kendall, aka George Preddy, has said so.

I have had no problem with the speed. The DP1 is far worse as one cannot take a photo while writing. With the Dp2M one can change settings and take new photos while the old is written to the card.

But Jaelkay, which other camera writes 45 to 60Mb faster to SD card ?

Nikon D800E writes 75mb files to card all but instantly. Sorry 'bout that.

-- hide signature --

AF takes away the Zen in photography

You don't understand my point. No one complains about the Foveon sensor or the Sigma lens. On contrary, at least the sensor is exceptional. The problems are with the DP series bodies. So, try to imagine to have the Foveon sensor inside, for example the Fuji X100 body. That would be a camera with the capital C...

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Helge Hafting
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to flektogon, Sep 9, 2012

flektogon wrote:

Just imagine for example Sony having the Foveon sensor. This idea doesn’t need more words…

In that case, we would have to buy a Sony instead of a Sigma to get a foveon sensor. So what?

The foveon sensor is not "lost" to the world of photography. If you want one, you can buy one - from Sigma. There is no problem with that. Put a Sony sticker on the camera, if you actually care about brand names.

The sensor has some shortcomings, such as high-iso performance. But I don't think Sony ownership would change that.

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flektogon
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to Helge Hafting, Sep 9, 2012

Helge Hafting wrote:

flektogon wrote:

Just imagine for example Sony having the Foveon sensor. This idea doesn’t need more words…

In that case, we would have to buy a Sony instead of a Sigma to get a foveon sensor. So what?

The foveon sensor is not "lost" to the world of photography. If you want one, you can buy one - from Sigma. There is no problem with that. Put a Sony sticker on the camera, if you actually care about brand names.

The sensor has some shortcomings, such as high-iso performance. But I don't think Sony ownership would change that.

Another misunderstanding. Please, go to:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1027&message=42444289

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victorgv
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to flektogon, Sep 9, 2012

X100 bigger and more expensive and spec vise on sensor it closer to dp2 than dp2m and i strongly suspect that even original dp1 will win hands down under good light conditions,but i concur i myself like retro design better .
Still dp2m totaly wins on price value.

flektogon wrote:

vi

You don't understand my point. No one complains about the Foveon sensor or the Sigma lens. On contrary, at least the sensor is exceptional. The problems are with the DP series bodies. So, try to imagine to have the Foveon sensor inside, for example the Fuji X100 body. That would be a camera with the capital C...

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yvind Strm
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Re: Yes and no
In reply to PrebenR, Sep 9, 2012

PrebenR wrote:

Roland Karlsson wrote:

The SD cameras on the other hand is a totally other business IMHO. The competition is much better at making such things. So - a Foveon sensor in a Canon, Nikon, Pentax or Sony DSLR would be very interesting.

Just curious as to what you think would be better in a say Nikon or Canon DSLR?

Faster AF? High ISO? Controls? Or are you thinking of the lenses.

Faster and more accurate AF.
Usable IQ above 400 ISO.
Canon or Nikon mount.

Lenses, yes. Definately. Sigma has a few good lenses, Nikon and Canon a whole range.
A modern, not two year old LCD
100% viewfinder coverage in a top model.
Much better playback.
Live view. PDAF
More than one CWB position.
Kelvin WB
Fine tune from presets WB.
Better battery life.
Video, maybe even "RAW video".
Repair centers in almost every country.
Lens rental options around the world.
Pro support.

Maybe I can dig up more, if thats not enough?

I'm not saying it wouldn't have been better, but you also get a lot of stuff you don't really need as they have to sell features when the sensor does only small incremental improvements (perhaps except the D800 sensor).

Of which most want bother you at all, as you, the photographer, chooses what to use of the extra features.

My biggest annoyance with my SD15 is that it does back/front focus. I need to fix this, but haven't had the time yet.

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AF takes away the Zen in photography

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Jaelkay
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to victorgv, Sep 9, 2012

victorgv wrote:

I am kind of tired people complaining about Sigma DP series and compairing it with begemoth.

I wasn't comparing it. I answered a question.

1. Sigma first on the market with foveon.

Still not working properly. Weird colours, inconsistent focus, inconsistent exposure and green/purple splotches in shadow

2. Sigma first with large sensor in compact body.

And?

3. Comparision with D800 is ridicuolus one weight 1000g without glass and cost 3000 without glass, dp2m 355g with glass and cost 1000.

Again - I was not making a comparison. I answered a question. Do please learn to read and understand what you're reading. Thank you

Just my 2 cents.

P.S. I wish i could by d800 but to expensive and would sit on shelf in my house - too big. Goes for other dslrs too..

Jaelkay wrote:

PrebenR wrote:

Jaelkay wrote:

Eddy Teddy wrote:

I have the DP2 Merrill on loan; the images are very nice, truly amazing - better than the other cameras I have at hand; Sony Rx-100, Samsung Ex1 and Canon EOS 20D. I think performance is ok, but RAW writing is slow. But... Battery life time is weak... I have a very early production model; might be better now. Could anybody give us some numbers on battery life time?

If you're experiencing problems with speed, you cannot possibly have been using the camera. Kendall, aka George Preddy, has said so.

I have had no problem with the speed. The DP1 is far worse as one cannot take a photo while writing. With the Dp2M one can change settings and take new photos while the old is written to the card.

But Jaelkay, which other camera writes 45 to 60Mb faster to SD card ?

Nikon D800E writes 75mb files to card all but instantly. Sorry 'bout that.

-- hide signature --

AF takes away the Zen in photography

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Jaelkay
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to flektogon, Sep 9, 2012

flektogon wrote:

victorgv wrote:

I am kind of tired people complaining about Sigma DP series and compairing it with begemoth.
1. Sigma first on the market with foveon.
2. Sigma first with large sensor in compact body.

3. Comparision with D800 is ridicuolus one weight 1000g without glass and cost 3000 without glass, dp2m 355g with glass and cost 1000.
Just my 2 cents.

P.S. I wish i could by d800 but to expensive and would sit on shelf in my house - too big. Goes for other dslrs too..

Jaelkay wrote:

PrebenR wrote:

Jaelkay wrote:

Eddy Teddy wrote:

I have the DP2 Merrill on loan; the images are very nice, truly amazing - better than the other cameras I have at hand; Sony Rx-100, Samsung Ex1 and Canon EOS 20D. I think performance is ok, but RAW writing is slow. But... Battery life time is weak... I have a very early production model; might be better now. Could anybody give us some numbers on battery life time?

If you're experiencing problems with speed, you cannot possibly have been using the camera. Kendall, aka George Preddy, has said so.

I have had no problem with the speed. The DP1 is far worse as one cannot take a photo while writing. With the Dp2M one can change settings and take new photos while the old is written to the card.

But Jaelkay, which other camera writes 45 to 60Mb faster to SD card ?

Nikon D800E writes 75mb files to card all but instantly. Sorry 'bout that.

-- hide signature --

AF takes away the Zen in photography

You don't understand my point. No one complains about the Foveon sensor or the Sigma lens. On contrary, at least the sensor is exceptional. The problems are with the DP series bodies. So, try to imagine to have the Foveon sensor inside, for example the Fuji X100 body. That would be a camera with the capital C...

There are a lot of complaints about the Foveon sensor. Same problems persist that first appeared over 10 years ago.

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victorgv
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Re: Sigma’s ownership of Foveon sensor – greatest loss for the photograph
In reply to Jaelkay, Sep 9, 2012

Answer that $1000 compact writes slower than $3000 full body DSLR is a complaint .
Still not working properly is a complaint.

My point you have relatively cheap camera which under good light is on the level or better than much more expensive equipment.

Jaelkay wrote:

victorgv wrote:

I am kind of tired people complaining about Sigma DP series and compairing it with begemoth.

I wasn't comparing it. I answered a question.

1. Sigma first on the market with foveon.

Still not working properly. Weird colours, inconsistent focus, inconsistent exposure and green/purple splotches in shadow

2. Sigma first with large sensor in compact body.

And?

3. Comparision with D800 is ridicuolus one weight 1000g without glass and cost 3000 without glass, dp2m 355g with glass and cost 1000.

Again - I was not making a comparison. I answered a question. Do please learn to read and understand what you're reading. Thank you

Just my 2 cents.

P.S. I wish i could by d800 but to expensive and would sit on shelf in my house - too big. Goes for other dslrs too..

Jaelkay wrote:

PrebenR wrote:

Jaelkay wrote:

Eddy Teddy wrote:

I have the DP2 Merrill on loan; the images are very nice, truly amazing - better than the other cameras I have at hand; Sony Rx-100, Samsung Ex1 and Canon EOS 20D. I think performance is ok, but RAW writing is slow. But... Battery life time is weak... I have a very early production model; might be better now. Could anybody give us some numbers on battery life time?

If you're experiencing problems with speed, you cannot possibly have been using the camera. Kendall, aka George Preddy, has said so.

I have had no problem with the speed. The DP1 is far worse as one cannot take a photo while writing. With the Dp2M one can change settings and take new photos while the old is written to the card.

But Jaelkay, which other camera writes 45 to 60Mb faster to SD card ?

Nikon D800E writes 75mb files to card all but instantly. Sorry 'bout that.

-- hide signature --

AF takes away the Zen in photography

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adegroot
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this thread still going????
In reply to victorgv, Sep 9, 2012

I hope someone will jank out the Everyready batteries that seems to never die here.

Schweinefutter

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