650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison

Started Jul 4, 2012 | Discussions
Roberto Piazza
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650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
Jul 4, 2012

Has anyone compared the two here:

http://www.dpreview.com/previews/canon-eos-650d-rebel-t4i/7

I was looking forward to doing that...

At least to my eyes, both in jpeg and [even more] in processed RAW, and at any ISO (more on high) it seems to me that the 650 is slightly worse than the 600: less sharp, more noise.

Am I wrong?
What do you think about it?

ciao

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Canon EOS 600D (EOS Rebel T3i / EOS Kiss X5) Canon EOS 650D (EOS Rebel T4i / EOS Kiss X6i)
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Roger Nordin
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to Roberto Piazza, Jul 4, 2012

Yes has been observed in other threads here as well. For fun, compare to 3 year old 7D to the 650D at RAW at, say, ISO 6400. The 7D is practically free from chroma noise, compared to the 650D. It sure seem the phase AF sensors on the same chip much be draining much light from the rest of the sensor chip, or how can it otherwise be that a 3 year newer sensor at the same 18 MP resolution is performing worse at the same ISO levels?

Yes the 7D may have slightly more professional read-out technology - or, it had, that is. 3 years ago. By now any such technological advantage should have trickled down to consumer level by long. And indeed, the 600D comparison shows the same.

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Roger

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Timbukto
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to Roberto Piazza, Jul 4, 2012

Hard to say, I pulled both RAW files in lightroom and found that the 650D is shot with a faster shutter speed but was also more exposed (histogram more to the right). I think by default it seems a tad noisier with qualities more like my GF3 in terms of noise performance (bigger splotchy magenta noise, etc..) On the otherhand the real-world shot shows that they pulled shadows significantly on the coastline picture and it didn't band. Not all of my pictures will significantly band on my 600D but I definitely can get it to do so. Also wonder if more noise will come in when you use the new onboard PDAF with live view vs a traditional mirror slap shot! It could be the 'use' of the new technology can introduce some noise when reading from the sensor too.

Remember traditional Canon noise qualities was finer pitch noise that exhibits cross-hatch type patterns. This noise is definitely not fine pitch anymore and seems larger and splotchy...its very Panasonic MFT in character to be honest.

Finally there can easily be some sample variation on sensors just like there is sample variation on processing CPU's (as to which hold up better at certain clock speeds, etc).

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AmateurSnaps
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to Timbukto, Jul 5, 2012

They are very odd as the images should be identical?

Just shows even in a studio setup nothing is certain.

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Corne Ferreira
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to Roberto Piazza, Jul 5, 2012

I dont see what you guys do, look at the fur above the old girl on the money, the paperclips.... change the comparison to the 550, 7d, 600 and you will see a slight improvment with the 7D being the softest 550 next 600 and 650 pretty much the same. the camera is not set perfectly paralel to the scene this is easy to spot with the paterns top left and right.

I have both 7d and 650 and so far I prefer the results from the 650 it is very marginal but I find it has less noise at lower ISOs and maybe not less noise at higher ISOs but you need less sharpning and this puts it on par for the end results.

focus performance the 7D is still king for speed esp in low light but the focus seems more reliable at this stage for pin point accuracy. this could just be new broom syndrom though. Ill do a proper test this weekend in low light and day light near and far I know tracking the 7D will be better.

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seri_art
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to Roberto Piazza, Jul 5, 2012

I definitely see the same thing in the RAW shoots of the coin at ISO 1600 and above. The 650D is not "slightly" worse to me, but very noticeably worse than the 600D.

Roberto Piazza wrote:

At least to my eyes, both in jpeg and [even more] in processed RAW, and at any ISO (more on high) it seems to me that the 650 is slightly worse than the 600: less sharp, more noise.

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tymevest
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to seri_art, Jul 5, 2012

You can compare several images side by side at http://www.imaging-resource.com/IMCOMP/COMPS01.HTM

Select the camera on each side, then the images, then click on the image for a full resolution view of each. Scroll to compare different areas.

I looked at several up to ISO 12800 and in my opinion, the T3i was slightly better in all of them than the T4i. But the T4i's abilities would outweigh the slight loss of IQ if I were buying a new camera.

They are probably are done at different times. For the most accurate test, both cameras would have to be tested at the same time, with the same settings, and with the exact same lens.
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Corne Ferreira
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to tymevest, Jul 5, 2012

tymevest wrote:

You can compare several images side by side at http://www.imaging-resource.com/IMCOMP/COMPS01.HTM

Even here it is hard to make any call the focus points and lighting is not identical.

Go back and compare any ISO: 550 vs 650

Angle of light first look on the WB/focus disk one is shiney the other flat this shows the light is faling at different angles. and the 550 exposure is less than the 650 and 600 and it shows more than I would expect.

Detail look at the neck line fabric detail and sharpness so the 550 is a touch better. Now scroll down and look at the table and sleeve detail the 650 is a touch better.

Conclusion to me is focus points are not 100% the same plus the angle of light will change the micro contrast resulting in some areas looking sharper to the 550 and some to the 650. At minimum there has been no improvment from the 550 to the 650 in IQ.

Personal opinion is it is up a touch (minute at it) but it is better than my 7D (IQ only) and I stress my 7D, especially at lower ISO there is less noise/artifacts/Orange peel call it what you like in plain areas like sky

They are probably are done at different times. For the most accurate test, both cameras would have to be tested at the same time, with the same settings, and with the exact same lens.

Could not agree more not so much about the time as its a studio, time is not important butthe angle of the light changed wich is the sam as a diferent time of day.

Tymevest

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justharry
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to tymevest, Jul 6, 2012

Playing with DPRs widget, It is likewise my impression that the 600d edges out the 650d in IQ, sometimes slightly, sometimes more so ...but, when I go on the Imaging Resource site and compare full size images side by side, the 4i - to my eyes - looks better ..not only vs the 3i, but side by side vs several respectable cameras.

If the video performance lives up to the tout, I think this may very well be my next camera.

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dbannerz71
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to Roberto Piazza, Jul 8, 2012

The ISO 1600 shot and possibly others are out of focus. It seams to me something is a bit odd about these test shots. I've seen much better on other review sites and given the significance that is placed on them, DPReview needs to go back and reshoot the set just to make sure everything was set correct and in focus (ie. NR disabled, standard or neutral picture style, whatever was set on the 600D etc.).

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XVOYAGERX
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to justharry, Aug 19, 2012

JustHarry

Get 650d as your next cam, you wont regret it, i had a 600d and the features alone on the 650d blow it away never mind image quality, speaking of that, in my honest opinion colors, sharpness, contrast etc do seem better than the 600d, not much, but better, but the main 600d killer here is the fantastic touch screen, the speed at doing camera adjustments is incredible and the AUTO-FOCUS just as good as a 60d easily outgunning the 600d, as i said earlier JustHarry you will not regret getting the 650D, dont be put off by all the 600d fanboys and how their beloved 600d's are better than the 650d, thats outright rubbish, the 600d's are last generation, in other words 'old fashioned' a new rebel now rules the roost.

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DSHAPK
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to XVOYAGERX, Aug 19, 2012

In my own informal testing, the t4i easily outguns my t2i in every operational measure.

So while dpreview came out with one set of measurements, I am not in agreement with those results based on my real world testing.

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dbannerz71
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Re: 650d vs 600d in the Studio Scene comparison
In reply to DSHAPK, Aug 19, 2012

I fully agree. I had the rebel xti (400d) before my new t4i (650d) and I can't believe how much better the image quality is (@ higher ISO settings like 1600 for example) as well as the rest of the functionality. I just hope DPReview reshoots the ISO 1600 set (at a minimum) given the importance placed on these reviews. There was a time I thought about going with a 7d since it seemed to be a lateral "up grade" to stay with the rebel series but I have since come to realize that is definately not the case. I sold my xti back to B&H and haven't looked back.

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