Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..

Started Jun 8, 2012 | Discussions
simon65
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Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
Jun 8, 2012

650D 575 g 133 x 100 x 79 mm

550D 530 g 129 x 98 x 62 mm

500D 520 g "

450D 475 g "

Yep like the uptenth sequel of an original blockbuster movie the Canon 650D carries the name and branding of the original award winning hit, but there endith the similarities.

Bloated, fat and overlong is what Hollywood sequels usually end up as, and replace 'overlong' for 'too heavy' and you've got the 650D.

The XXXD line has finally lost all touch with its orginal raison d'etre, ie a lightweight value DSLR. Add on a 15-85 mm lens and it all adds up to 1.150 Kg which is far too heavy, thank you Canon.

Sony's NEX line-up offer far better size, weight, sensor size, and IQ ratios for my taste. And indeed given the 650D's USD 950 launch price the Sony's are far better value for money as well - USD 950 taking the 650D close to NEX-7 territory, and that's a no brainer for anyone!

I'll be selling my Canon kit and moving on. This is one sequel too many.

TTMartin
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Re: Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
In reply to simon65, Jun 8, 2012

Cool dude, enjoy your Sony experience!

I hear the Sony NEX has a great viewfinder, D'oh.

Also, be sure you buy plenty of spare batteries.

simon65 wrote:

650D 575 g 133 x 100 x 79 mm

550D 530 g 129 x 98 x 62 mm

500D 520 g "

450D 475 g "

Yep like the uptenth sequel of an original blockbuster movie the Canon 650D carries the name and branding of the original award winning hit, but there endith the similarities.

Bloated, fat and overlong is what Hollywood sequels usually end up as, and replace 'overlong' for 'too heavy' and you've got the 650D.

The XXXD line has finally lost all touch with its orginal raison d'etre, ie a lightweight value DSLR. Add on a 15-85 mm lens and it all adds up to 1.150 Kg which is far too heavy, thank you Canon.

Sony's NEX line-up offer far better size, weight, sensor size, and IQ ratios for my taste. And indeed given the 650D's USD 950 launch price the Sony's are far better value for money as well - USD 950 taking the 650D close to NEX-7 territory, and that's a no brainer for anyone!

I'll be selling my Canon kit and moving on. This is one sequel too many.

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R2D2
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Re: Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
In reply to simon65, Jun 8, 2012

simon65 wrote:

Bloated, fat and overlong is what Hollywood sequels usually end up as, and replace 'overlong' for 'too heavy' and you've got the 650D.

Might have to bulk up your Biceps for that extra couple ounces, LOL!

R2

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chiane
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Re: Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
In reply to R2D2, Jun 8, 2012

Will you be buying both of Sony's lens offerings now, or get one now and the other later?

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bluejake
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Re: Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
In reply to TTMartin, Jun 8, 2012

TTMartin wrote:

Cool dude, enjoy your Sony experience!

I hear the Sony NEX has a great viewfinder, D'oh.

I detect irony but the Sony Nex 7 does have a great viewfinder. To quote the DPR review of that camera:

"The NEX-7's large viewfinder is comparable in size to that of a full frame SLR. It offers a 100% field of view, with no cropping of the preview image. Sony's OLED unit is hugely impressive, even if you're used to the previously state-of-the-art units used by the likes of Panasonic and Olympus.

The advantages of an EVF are obvious. The NEX-7's can offer a preview of how your images will look in terms of brightness, white balance and colour rendition, as well as a truly accurate depth of field preview that's perfectly visible (if sometimes noisy) even when stopped down to very small apertures. It can also overlay a huge amount of shooting information, including a live histogram and electronic level. You can fluidly move the AF point anywhere in the frame, and engage a magnified view for accurate manual focus. Last but by no means least, in concert with the Triple-control-dial system it allows you to adjust pretty well any setting without removing the camera from your eye."

I tend to agree with many other posters here that Canon could have built a great camera if they wanted to but they are more interested in protecting their existing DSLR sales rather than going all out out to build the best camera they can for a particular market segment.

Hopefully the much anticipated Canon mirrorless will be something genuinely innovative and better than rival offerings rather than an intentionly crippled offering designed to protect DSLR sales like the Nikon 1 series and the Canon G1X.

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TTMartin
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Re: Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
In reply to bluejake, Jun 8, 2012

Oh, you mean the $350 add on view finder, on top of the $1350 for the Sony NEX 7 with a 18-55 lens.

At those prices I could buy a T4i with 18-135 lens, and a lightweight T3 with a 18-55 lens and still have money left over for accessories.

Like I said Enjoy the Sony Experience!

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bluejake
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Re: Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
In reply to TTMartin, Jun 8, 2012

TTMartin wrote:

Oh, you mean the $350 add on view finder, on top of the $1350 for the Sony NEX 7 with a 18-55 lens.

At those prices I could buy a T4i with 18-135 lens, and a lightweight T3 with a 18-55 lens and still have money left over for accessories.

Like I said Enjoy the Sony Experience!

No I don't. The Sony Nex 7 has a built in viewfinder. I have no idea why you are so defensive. It is clear to everyone that at the moment Canon is concerned with protecting their DSLR sales so they are taking a very conservative incremental approach. As I say I just hope their mirrorless offering is the best camera they could make for that segment rather than something built to protect their DSLR sales. Fingers crossed.

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Shorthand
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Re: Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
In reply to TTMartin, Jun 8, 2012

A little bit of sanity for what has quickly become a religious debate:

The NEX 7 includes a viewfinder.
The NEX 5 & 5N have add-on viewfinders.

I agree that the NEX system is expensive, but I also am attracted by its combination of superior sensors, compactness, and quieter shutter. With our first bun in the oven, high quality compact child photography is about to become very important.

Thankfully, I won't be needing anything until just after Christmas, and there are hints of some VERY interesting announcements between now and then.

As a market strategy, Canon knows that its sensors are falling behind so its adding as many other real features as it can to the Rebel. I have to assume that it has a sensor in the oven, but I have also gotten to the point that I can't wait much longer. I realize fully that low ISO dynamic range isn't particularly key for properly-lit photos of humans, though.

As for the extra weight ... the point is real, but I would rather have the ruggedness than a few onces. The volume is more important to portability than the weight.

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jvkelley
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Re: Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
In reply to simon65, Jun 8, 2012

simon65 wrote:

The XXXD line has finally lost all touch with its orginal raison d'etre, ie a lightweight value DSLR. Add on a 15-85 mm lens and it all adds up to 1.150 Kg which is far too heavy, thank you Canon.

You should look up the starting list price for the Rebel line. The first 3 cameras in this line were all around $1000. If Canon comes out with a 1200D, I'm sure it'll be lighter and less expensive than the 650D.

I'll be selling my Canon kit and moving on. This is one sequel too many.

You're selling your current camera because a new camera that you don't own is heavier? This doesn't seem logical.

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underpaid
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Re: Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
In reply to simon65, Jun 8, 2012

Bye byeee!
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simon65
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Sony NEX-F5 + 16-50 pancake combo
In reply to jvkelley, Jun 8, 2012

I'll be selling my Canon kit and moving on. This is one sequel too many.

jvkelley wrote:

You're selling your current camera because a new camera that you don't own is heavier? This doesn't seem logical.

I've been in the market for an upgrade for some time as after a wedding last year I'm looking for improved high ISO and generally higher IQ, and a better lens than my 17-85 mm to go woth it.

The new NEXs look good, but I was holding off until I saw the 650D specs. If I'd gone with the 650D I would have paired it with the 15-85 mm, hence my comment on their combined weight.

Now I'll either get the forthcoming Sony NEX-F5 with 16-50mm G pancake zoom lens (due this summer), or the NEX-7 with the same lens.

Not only will both be lighter and more compact that the 650D plus 15-85mm, but I'll wager they'll out perform the 650D on ISO and IQ as well.

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simon65
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Canon live in fear of cannibalism
In reply to bluejake, Jun 8, 2012

bluejake wrote:

I tend to agree with many other posters here that Canon could have built a great camera if they wanted to but they are more interested in protecting their existing DSLR sales rather than going all out out to build the best camera they can for a particular market segment.

Protecting their high end and professional camera sales is what Canon is all about, and its led them to tie themselves in knots fretting about model cannibalism, disabling various functions, and ommiting others where it would be just as easy and cheap to include them.

It's another major reason for me leaving Canon.

The likes of Sony and Olympus don't have a professional camera range to 'protect' and so are happy to push the boat out for their semi-pro or amateur camera range, with great IQ, features and state of the art technology.

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davel33
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This is so stupid its funny :)
In reply to simon65, Jun 8, 2012

650D 575 g 133 x 100 x 79 mm
550D 530 g 129 x 98 x 62 mm
500D 520 g "
450D 475 g "

Man this has TROLL all over it

What he did not add was the 600D is the same weight and size, the very first Rebel dslr the 300D was 645g and 142 x 100 x 72. It looks to me like the 650d is dead on what the Rebel line has been from day ONE, so why the post? The 650D does look very interesting, I cant wait to see what the 70D and the 7D II will be

Dave

PS I used both the 300D and 350D till the 30D came out and now use the 7D and G1X so I have had a few Rebels. Also the 300D would cost about $1000 body only adjusting for inflation

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Olga Johnson
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Your logic escapes me
In reply to simon65, Jun 8, 2012

You left out the:

300D 645 g 133.1 x 99.5 x 79.7

600D 570 g 142 x 99 x 72

As you can see, weight and dimensions have never been static. In my experience, the 300D had the most comfortable fit in the hand. (And I've owned a number of Rebels.)

If the NEX-7 gives you all you need from your photographic requirements, go for it. Even at half its price, I wouldn't bother with it because it does not meet MY needs.

Then again, the logic escapes me. You will sell your current camera because you don't like the size and weight of the newest model? Or did I misunderstand what you are saying?

simon65 wrote:

650D 575 g 133 x 100 x 79 mm

550D 530 g 129 x 98 x 62 mm

500D 520 g "

450D 475 g "

Yep like the uptenth sequel of an original blockbuster movie the Canon 650D carries the name and branding of the original award winning hit, but there endith the similarities.

Bloated, fat and overlong is what Hollywood sequels usually end up as, and replace 'overlong' for 'too heavy' and you've got the 650D.

The XXXD line has finally lost all touch with its orginal raison d'etre, ie a lightweight value DSLR. Add on a 15-85 mm lens and it all adds up to 1.150 Kg which is far too heavy, thank you Canon.

Sony's NEX line-up offer far better size, weight, sensor size, and IQ ratios for my taste. And indeed given the 650D's USD 950 launch price the Sony's are far better value for money as well - USD 950 taking the 650D close to NEX-7 territory, and that's a no brainer for anyone!

I'll be selling my Canon kit and moving on. This is one sequel too many.

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Lee Jay
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I don't like my Rebel because it is too small
In reply to simon65, Jun 8, 2012

I don't like my T2i for long-period shooting because it's too small. My 20D and 5D are far more comfortable to use for long periods.

I think Canon should make a tiny camera for people that either don't shoot much or have tiny, non-human hands, and a larger one for people that shoot more and have ordinary human-sized hands.
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tomtom50
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How did this thread become about Sony?
In reply to davel33, Jun 8, 2012

The 650D is on the large and expensive side for an entry level DSLR, but Canon has the smaller, lighter and less expensive T3 (1100D) at the very bottom end, so his criticism off. Canon still makes a small, light, and inexpensive Rebel.

The 650D is almost twice the price of the T3. Calling it entry-level is a stretch. The 1100D may not be cutting edge, but at $499 with kit lens it is cheaper than high-end point & shoots and only $100 more than the cheapest mirrorless cameras.

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TTMartin
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Re: Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
In reply to Shorthand, Jun 8, 2012

I stand corrected.

I've had some very bad expriences with Sony customer service so I'm not impressed with them as a company.

If I were to go for a mirrorless camera today it would be the Olympus OM-D.

At least the M4/3 standard has a greater lens selection and the OM-D has enviromental sealing and would make a reasonable travel camera.

I agree with the poster that meantioned small size is not always a plus, I shoot sports with a 7D and purchased a used XTi to have as a everyday camera/travel camera. I ended up adding a battery grip to make it easier and more comfortable to hold.

As meantioned somewhere the Canon T4i's hybrid sensor with integrated phase detect autofocus paves the way for a Canon mirrorless camera. This addresses the issues with the contrast detect autofocus of existing mirrorless cameras or the light loss in Sony's pellicle mirror cameras.

Shorthand wrote:

A little bit of sanity for what has quickly become a religious debate:

The NEX 7 includes a viewfinder.
The NEX 5 & 5N have add-on viewfinders.

I agree that the NEX system is expensive, but I also am attracted by its combination of superior sensors, compactness, and quieter shutter. With our first bun in the oven, high quality compact child photography is about to become very important.

Thankfully, I won't be needing anything until just after Christmas, and there are hints of some VERY interesting announcements between now and then.

As a market strategy, Canon knows that its sensors are falling behind so its adding as many other real features as it can to the Rebel. I have to assume that it has a sensor in the oven, but I have also gotten to the point that I can't wait much longer. I realize fully that low ISO dynamic range isn't particularly key for properly-lit photos of humans, though.

As for the extra weight ... the point is real, but I would rather have the ruggedness than a few onces. The volume is more important to portability than the weight.

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Lee Jay
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Re: Bulkier, heavier and far too expensive, Canon kill the XXXD..
In reply to bluejake, Jun 8, 2012

bluejake wrote:

TTMartin wrote:

Cool dude, enjoy your Sony experience!

I hear the Sony NEX has a great viewfinder, D'oh.

I detect irony but the Sony Nex 7 does have a great viewfinder.

Correction, it has an electronic viewfinder, and there's nothing great about that except that it's better than an LCD.

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4thnebula
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You have a point...
In reply to simon65, Jun 8, 2012

I haven't thought this one out well yet. Love the hybrid af live view idea. It would be really super if the af speed with Canon largeEF and EF-S lenseswere able to compete with u43rds. This is probably a precursor to the soon to be announced Canon mirrorless. Canon may have planned this out well.

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simon65
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Re: How did this thread become about Sony?
In reply to tomtom50, Jun 8, 2012

tomtom50 wrote:

The 650D is on the large and expensive side for an entry level DSLR, but Canon has the smaller, lighter and less expensive T3 (1100D) at the very bottom end, so his criticism off. Canon still makes a small, light, and inexpensive Rebel.

The 650D is almost twice the price of the T3. Calling it entry-level is a stretch. The 1100D may not be cutting edge, but at $499 with kit lens it is cheaper than high-end point & shoots and only $100 more than the cheapest mirrorless cameras.

The problem is you're playing Canon's game and comparing the 650D with other Canon's and deciding on that basis that it isn't overpriced.

I meanwhile am comparing the Canon the 650D with the Sony NEX-5N/F5 among others and on that basis it is overpriced. As for the 1100D its not even in the same league as a NEX-5N.

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