DR at base iso Canon 5dmk2 and D800 and HDR picture from one exposure

Started May 22, 2012 | Discussions
Mikael Risedal
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DR at base iso Canon 5dmk2 and D800 and HDR picture from one exposure
May 22, 2012

Everyone has seen Hans Kruse's beautiful images here at dpreview, in another thread we discussed the D800 large dynamic range and possibilities of an exposure and then the conditions to make a HDR picture. There are many advantages with one exposure , we do not have to take several shots with different exposures and have the camera on a tripod. We can also take moving subjects.

This raw files are exposed after the high lights = sun and then developed so no mesured clippings / warnings can be seen , and then the raw files are developed = one after high lights and one after mid tones and shadows.
Both cameras identical exposed in terms of time, aperture and 100 ISO.
Raw files are then treated identical.

The cameras 5dmk2 and D800 provide different conditions = from an exposure develop the image after the low levels and highlight
Raw files can be provided so you can do your own test.

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Canon EOS 5D Nikon D800 Pentax K-r
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Great Bustard
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Simple, really.
In reply to Mikael Risedal, May 22, 2012

Just use a greater exposure on the 5D2 or print it darker. Problem solved.

Mikael Risedal wrote:

Everyone has seen Hans Kruse's beautiful images here at dpreview, in another thread we discussed the D800 large dynamic range and possibilities of an exposure and then the conditions to make a HDR picture. There are many advantages with one exposure , we do not have to take several shots with different exposures and have the camera on a tripod. We can also take moving subjects.

This raw files are exposed after the high lights = sun and then developed so no mesured clippings / warnings can be seen , and then the raw files are developed = one after high lights and one after mid tones and shadows.
Both cameras identical exposed in terms of time, aperture and 100 ISO.
Raw files are then treated identical.

The cameras 5dmk2 and D800 provide different conditions = from an exposure develop the image after the low levels and highlight
Raw files can be provided so you can do your own test.

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Mikael Risedal
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Re: Simple, really.
In reply to Great Bustard, May 22, 2012

and clipp the high lights.

I know that you know and what we know the common Canon shooter do not know before they try a sensor with 14 stops of DR, free from noise and banding

Great Bustard wrote:
Just use a greater exposure on the 5D2 or print it darker. Problem solved.

Mikael Risedal wrote:

Everyone has seen Hans Kruse's beautiful images here at dpreview, in another thread we discussed the D800 large dynamic range and possibilities of an exposure and then the conditions to make a HDR picture. There are many advantages with one exposure , we do not have to take several shots with different exposures and have the camera on a tripod. We can also take moving subjects.

This raw files are exposed after the high lights = sun and then developed so no mesured clippings / warnings can be seen , and then the raw files are developed = one after high lights and one after mid tones and shadows.
Both cameras identical exposed in terms of time, aperture and 100 ISO.
Raw files are then treated identical.

The cameras 5dmk2 and D800 provide different conditions = from an exposure develop the image after the low levels and highlight
Raw files can be provided so you can do your own test.

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GiovanniB
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RAW files?
In reply to Mikael Risedal, May 22, 2012

Mikael Risedal wrote:

Raw files can be provided so you can do your own test.

I'd appreciate being able to try them in a different converter.

However, of course a 14 stops DR is advantageous, and nobody might seriously claim the 5D Mk. II to be particularly good in terms of DR (or the Mk. III, for that matter). Even the Sony Alpha 900 was much better.

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Great Bustard
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Re: Simple, really.
In reply to Mikael Risedal, May 22, 2012

Mikael Risedal wrote:

and clipp the high lights.

Meh. Who needs details in the bright portion of the photo?

I know that you know and what we know the common Canon shooter do not know before they try a sensor with 14 stops of DR, free from noise and banding

To me, extended DR is like having a faster lens. If you don't use the wider aperture that the faster lens offers, you may as well just use a slower lens. But, then again, there are those for whom the wider apertures are indispensible.

However, just like wide aperture photography, there are those that will deride wide DR as "useless".

But we both know that if the 5D3 were the camera sporting the 36 MP with 14 stops of DR at base ISO, and the D800 were the camera sporting 22 MP and 11 stops of DR at base ISO, how things would go.

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Mikael Risedal
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Re: RAW files?
In reply to GiovanniB, May 22, 2012

5dmk3 is not better than 5dmk2 at base iso
Im trying sprend, please wait

GiovanniB wrote:

Mikael Risedal wrote:

Raw files can be provided so you can do your own test.

I'd appreciate being able to try them in a different converter.

However, of course a 14 stops DR is advantageous, and nobody might seriously claim the 5D Mk. II to be particularly good in terms of DR (or the Mk. III, for that matter). Even the Sony Alpha 900 was much better.

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Dan Goldman
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Re: RAW files?
In reply to GiovanniB, May 22, 2012

Hey Mikael,

What about comparing apples with apples ?

In 2009 I was a bunch of years younger and had much more hair...

What about you ?

Funny, a guy that I know told me not to trust people from the south ....

Dan

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David Hull
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Re: RAW files?
In reply to Mikael Risedal, May 22, 2012

Mikael Risedal wrote:
5dmk3 is not better than 5dmk2 at base iso
Im trying sprend, please wait

GiovanniB wrote:

Mikael Risedal wrote:

Raw files can be provided so you can do your own test.

I'd appreciate being able to try them in a different converter.

However, of course a 14 stops DR is advantageous, and nobody might seriously claim the 5D Mk. II to be particularly good in terms of DR (or the Mk. III, for that matter). Even the Sony Alpha 900 was much better.

In terms of DR the 5DIII is no better than the 5DII but in terms of what you are comparing here it is definitely better. From the measurements that I have seen, there is less pattern noise and it is unidirectional which makes it much easier to manage it the time comes that you have to.

Aside from that, why continue to beat a horse that has been dead for a long time – what do you hope to accomplish with this? At this point I don't think there are many who deny that the Canon sensor technology has this charactoristic and that Sony has solved it.

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David Franklin
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Re: DR at base iso Canon 5dmk2 and D800 and HDR picture from one exposure
In reply to Mikael Risedal, May 22, 2012

It's really hard to believe that a small core group of people feel so unbelievably insecure about themselves or their gear, or maybe even some anatomical parts, that they try to make the same points, unbidden, in the wrong forum, with no other possible rationale other than baiting people, over and over and over and over. Why? The answer to that question might bring some very well deserved clarity to the poor wretches who continue to post these pathetic DR rants with the regularity of idiot savants repeating their thinking to no one in particular and some relief to those of us who wish to read about things that matter.

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ak1999
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Re: DR at base iso Canon 5dmk2 and D800 and HDR picture from one exposure
In reply to David Franklin, May 22, 2012

David Franklin wrote:

It's really hard to believe that a small core group of people feel so unbelievably insecure about themselves or their gear, or maybe even some anatomical parts, that they try to make the same points, unbidden, in the wrong forum, with no other possible rationale other than baiting people, over and over and over and over.

Does this small core group include chironNYC?

I'm guess it does not ...

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Mikael Risedal
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Re: RAW files?
In reply to David Hull, May 22, 2012

You can read that in my first message
If you are good at HDR you have better possibilities with one shot and d800.

David Hull wrote:

Mikael Risedal wrote:
5dmk3 is not better than 5dmk2 at base iso
Im trying sprend, please wait

GiovanniB wrote:

Mikael Risedal wrote:

Raw files can be provided so you can do your own test.

I'd appreciate being able to try them in a different converter.

However, of course a 14 stops DR is advantageous, and nobody might seriously claim the 5D Mk. II to be particularly good in terms of DR (or the Mk. III, for that matter). Even the Sony Alpha 900 was much better.

In terms of DR the 5DIII is no better than the 5DII but in terms of what you are comparing here it is definitely better. From the measurements that I have seen, there is less pattern noise and it is unidirectional which makes it much easier to manage it the time comes that you have to.

Aside from that, why continue to beat a horse that has been dead for a long time – what do you hope to accomplish with this? At this point I don't think there are many who deny that the Canon sensor technology has this charactoristic and that Sony has solved it.

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David Franklin
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Re: DR at base iso Canon 5dmk2 and D800 and HDR picture from one exposure
In reply to ak1999, May 22, 2012

Yes, he would be included if he posted his overheated pro-Canon posts on the Nikon forum. Maybe he does; I don't know, as I don't lurk there monitoring what is said about the 5D3. Otherwise, he is just an overzealous booster in the correct forum.

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Phil Hill
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Re: DR at base iso Canon 5dmk2 and D800 and HDR picture from one exposure
In reply to Mikael Risedal, May 22, 2012

Well, the 5D2 is approaching four years and is likely discontinued after existing stocks are sold, while the D800 has its own forum where its capabilities have been covered in even greater detail.

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Mikael Risedal
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Re: RAW files?
In reply to GiovanniB, May 22, 2012

http://sprend.com/download.htm?C=4ff5aa905efc46928b006ae61969cb95
raw files d800+5dmk2

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Great Bustard
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Actually...
In reply to David Franklin, May 22, 2012

David Franklin wrote:

It's really hard to believe that a small core group of people feel so unbelievably insecure about themselves or their gear, or maybe even some anatomical parts, that they try to make the same points, unbidden, in the wrong forum, with no other possible rationale other than baiting people, over and over and over and over. Why? The answer to that question might bring some very well deserved clarity to the poor wretches who continue to post these pathetic DR rants with the regularity of idiot savants repeating their thinking to no one in particular and some relief to those of us who wish to read about things that matter.

...the problem is with people who are confused by subject lines like "DR at base iso Canon 5dmk2 and D800 and HDR picture from one exposure" and are unable to find another thread about another topic that they might have more interest in.

Or did I misinterpret? Is this the perfect thread to come and bitch in, since bitching is what does it for you?

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David Hull
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Re: RAW files?
In reply to Mikael Risedal, May 22, 2012

Mikael Risedal wrote:

You can read that in my first message
If you are good at HDR you have better possibilities with one shot and d800.

My bad... I didn't really pay attention to your subject line. I agree if shooting with one shot is your goal, you have a better chance with that camera. I was more taking issue with your comment that the 5DIII is no better than the 5DII which is not the case as far as I can tell. The FPN while still there is much more well behaved in the later camera. I doubt that it will hold up for what you are doing here though. A D800 is clearly not a prerequisite for outstanding HDR work, though as so many have demonstrated.

I find it interesting that the D800 includes the same sort of automated HDR feature that eh Canon does, they must have felt it was good for something

David Hull wrote:

Mikael Risedal wrote:
5dmk3 is not better than 5dmk2 at base iso
Im trying sprend, please wait

GiovanniB wrote:

Mikael Risedal wrote:

Raw files can be provided so you can do your own test.

I'd appreciate being able to try them in a different converter.

However, of course a 14 stops DR is advantageous, and nobody might seriously claim the 5D Mk. II to be particularly good in terms of DR (or the Mk. III, for that matter). Even the Sony Alpha 900 was much better.

In terms of DR the 5DIII is no better than the 5DII but in terms of what you are comparing here it is definitely better. From the measurements that I have seen, there is less pattern noise and it is unidirectional which makes it much easier to manage it the time comes that you have to.

Aside from that, why continue to beat a horse that has been dead for a long time – what do you hope to accomplish with this? At this point I don't think there are many who deny that the Canon sensor technology has this charactoristic and that Sony has solved it.

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Jasper in SF
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Indeed
In reply to David Franklin, May 22, 2012

+1

Sigh.

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David Hull
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Re: DR at base iso Canon 5dmk2 and D800 and HDR picture from one exposure
In reply to Phil Hill, May 22, 2012

Phil Hill wrote:

Well, the 5D2 is approaching four years and is likely discontinued after existing stocks are sold, while the D800 has its own forum where its capabilities have been covered in even greater detail.

Even in the 5DIII, though they haven’t stepped up to the same level as the Sony based cameras -- although the 5DIII does show some improvement over the 5DII WRT to the pattern noise. If this sort of thing is your goal, the Sony based Nikon's are your best bet (or the Pentax K5), but if you shoot Canon, just bang of two shots for this scene, no problem.

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Mikael Risedal
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Re: DR at base iso Canon 5dmk2 and D800 and HDR picture from one exposure
In reply to David Hull, May 23, 2012

The pattern noise is there in 5dmk3 but Canon have smeared it so it is not so visible any longer , and this was more an answer to Hans Kruse about to have the ability to take only one shot and make a more HDR like picture.

There are also raw converters who makes a better job with the 5d banding but there are nothing to do with the signal/noise ratio i the lowest levels because of the high read out noise in 5dmk2 and 5dmk3

David Hull wrote:

Phil Hill wrote:

Well, the 5D2 is approaching four years and is likely discontinued after existing stocks are sold, while the D800 has its own forum where its capabilities have been covered in even greater detail.

Even in the 5DIII, though they haven’t stepped up to the same level as the Sony based cameras -- although the 5DIII does show some improvement over the 5DII WRT to the pattern noise. If this sort of thing is your goal, the Sony based Nikon's are your best bet (or the Pentax K5), but if you shoot Canon, just bang of two shots for this scene, no problem.

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Phil Hill
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Re: DR at base iso Canon 5dmk2 and D800 and HDR picture from one exposure
In reply to David Hull, May 23, 2012

I don’t have a goal, just pondering the relevance of the OP. I’d be surprised if many are debating between purchasing a 5D2 and a D800, but if they are, there’s much more useful D800 info available in the Nikon forum.

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