How dare DPR say D800 is great! Can anyone say bias Locked

Started May 9, 2012 | Discussions
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Taikonaut
Senior MemberPosts: 2,513
Re: DPReview said it is the best. Period.
In reply to marianco, May 9, 2012

Period? Yuck!

marianco wrote:

QUOTE:

"if you're prepared to put in the effort, your reward is a degree of resolution and detail that is very, very impressive and visibly superior to anything else on the market in this form factor."

aftab
Veteran MemberPosts: 7,658Gear list
Re: How dare DPR say D800 is great! Can anyone say bias
In reply to Ecniv, May 9, 2012

Ecniv wrote:

After reading all these unbiased reports from Canon users, how is it possible that DPR come to the conclusion that this camera is awesome. They haven't got a clue and are showing a great deal of bias in favor of Nikon.

To be fair, I think everyone here who posted their opinion about D800 after using it thought it was a great camera. People here complained more about 5D3 than D800.

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ArabiaSandStorm
Regular MemberPosts: 128
Re: How dare DPR say D800 is great! Can anyone say bias
In reply to Taikonaut, May 9, 2012

Could this be the reason they are providing the D800E option?

Taikonaut wrote:

I'm curious why the reviewer made no mention of the extreme softness on the edges of D800 images. Only the centre 70% of the image actually takes advantage of the sensor resolution.

studio311
Contributing MemberPosts: 553
Re: d800 doesn't sound attractive in DPR review.
In reply to chironNYC, May 9, 2012

Ya know...in order to get the very best potential resolution out of the 22MP 5d3...you NEED to use a tripod, with a cable release and mirror lock up,etc. Better lenses result in better IQ. Guess what...in order to get the very best IQ potential out of the 12MP D700...you NEED to use a tripod, with a cable release and mirror lock up. Better lenses result in better IQ.

Professional technique results in better IQ. No surprise there. Doesn't matter what camera is being used.

I've been using the D800 for a few weeks now...and it is painless to use...no trouble at all.

chironNYC wrote:

You know, I have to say that after reading the DPR review of the d800, my takeaway is that the camera is a pain and awkward to use and that it would be more trouble than it is usually worth.

Their comments are what many here and elsewhere have been saying for some time.

Essentially, they say that you need to use view camera techniques to get the resolution the camera is capable of (Michael Reichmann even recommends a focusing loupe with the unusable liveview!). If you don't use these techniques--tripods, best lenses, low ISOs, high shutter speeds, mirror lock-up, etc., you can still take fine pictures, but you won't get the resolution that people think they are getting.

So who needs it? It is a cheap and portable view camera or medium format camera. But it ain't very attractive for the kind of shooting that people use 35mm for.

And then you still have all those other problems--unusable liveview, huge files, misaligned autofocus modules, melting camera parts, green LCDs, not focusing on left side sensors, electronic lock-ups, disabling features.

Who needs it? Some do, maybe for studio or tripod mounted macro/landscape. But for most others, there are better cameras elsewhere.

Ecniv wrote:

After reading all these unbiased reports from Canon users, how is it possible that DPR come to the conclusion that this camera is awesome. They haven't got a clue and are showing a great deal of bias in favor of Nikon.

studio311
Contributing MemberPosts: 553
Re: How dare DPR say D800 is great! Can anyone say bias
In reply to ArabiaSandStorm, May 9, 2012

Not sure why I bothering...but Taikonaut, your posts are as predictable as the sun rising in the east. Canon fanboy bs. There is absolutely NOTHING soft about the edges of D800 images. This has been demonstrated by preview's test and results, dxo mark and others, but I'm sure such evidence matters little to you.

ArabiaSandStorm wrote:
Could this be the reason they are providing the D800E option?

Taikonaut wrote:

I'm curious why the reviewer made no mention of the extreme softness on the edges of D800 images. Only the centre 70% of the image actually takes advantage of the sensor resolution.

KAllen
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,732Gear list
Re: How dare DPR say D800 is great! Can anyone say bias
In reply to Ecniv, May 9, 2012

Ecniv wrote:

After reading all these unbiased reports from Canon users, how is it possible that DPR come to the conclusion that this camera is awesome. They haven't got a clue and are showing a great deal of bias in favor of Nikon.

You should add a smiley face or something, so we know for sure you are joking. Without that you look a bit of a nutter.

Kevin.

frederic fahraeus
Contributing MemberPosts: 504
Re: How dare DPR say D800 is great! Can anyone say bias
In reply to Sal Baker, May 9, 2012

You nailed it! 100%. but all the happy weekend snappers here, wont believe a word of it, theyre already intoxicated by the 36MPs.

DPR? who are they to judge?

Dan_168
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,812
Re: d800 doesn't sound attractive in DPR review.
In reply to chironNYC, May 9, 2012

chironNYC wrote:

Essentially, they say that you need to use view camera techniques to get the resolution the camera is capable of (Michael Reichmann even recommends a focusing loupe with the unusable liveview!). If you don't use these techniques--tripods, best lenses, low ISOs, high shutter speeds, mirror lock-up, etc., you can still take fine pictures, but you won't get the resolution that people think they are getting.

Do you know some of us (mostly landscape shooters) actually using these techniques on all our current cameras, a 12MP or 22 MP, so no difference with the 36MP, same technique.

frederic fahraeus
Contributing MemberPosts: 504
Re: d800 doesn't sound attractive in DPR review.
In reply to chironNYC, May 9, 2012

I borrowed one for a few days, quality wise, sure, at 36MPs, it should be. Compared to my D3X, the D800, felt like a piece of plastic, not the built quality we are used to see.

Further, the AF, the tracking is terrible, the menues, millions of them are everything and yet nothing.

Jan Madsen
Senior MemberPosts: 2,398
Re: d800 doesn't sound attractive in DPR review.
In reply to chironNYC, May 9, 2012

Erhh what camera do you use yourself? To get the max out of my 1Ds-II I have to use:

  • The very best lenses (e.g. Sigma 70mm f2.8 macro, Canon 200mm f1.8)

  • Tripod

  • Mirror lockup (which is a pain in the ... to activate, thanks Canon)

  • Fast shutter speed (but not too fast because the shutter is unreliable above 1/2000s)

Nothing new in that. Measured linearily the D800 resolution is not that much greater than my camera (47%) or 5D2/3 (31 & 28%). It is not that the resolution has jumped an order of magnitude or something like that. It is an incremental advance.

But 90% of my images are taken with all other sorts of more or less inferior lenses, freehand, using shutter times on the limit (it is often dark here in Denmark), and ISO cranked up. Still a great camera.

chironNYC wrote:

You know, I have to say that after reading the DPR review of the d800, my takeaway is that the camera is a pain and awkward to use and that it would be more trouble than it is usually worth.

Their comments are what many here and elsewhere have been saying for some time.

Essentially, they say that you need to use view camera techniques to get the resolution the camera is capable of (Michael Reichmann even recommends a focusing loupe with the unusable liveview!). If you don't use these techniques--tripods, best lenses, low ISOs, high shutter speeds, mirror lock-up, etc., you can still take fine pictures, but you won't get the resolution that people think they are getting.

So who needs it? It is a cheap and portable view camera or medium format camera. But it ain't very attractive for the kind of shooting that people use 35mm for.

And then you still have all those other problems--unusable liveview, huge files, misaligned autofocus modules, melting camera parts, green LCDs, not focusing on left side sensors, electronic lock-ups, disabling features.

Who needs it? Some do, maybe for studio or tripod mounted macro/landscape. But for most others, there are better cameras elsewhere.

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  • Jan

nijkerk
Contributing MemberPosts: 808Gear list
Re: d800 doesn't sound attractive in DPR review.
In reply to Jan Madsen, May 9, 2012

Just wait ....how many of these fanboys will be complaining about "Canon bias" when the 5D3 gets a very good review...which it will..Photographers complaining because a camera requires good technique and the best lenses to get fantastic quality..doesnt that apply to all cameras?

Jan Madsen
Senior MemberPosts: 2,398
Re: d800 doesn't sound attractive in DPR review.
In reply to nijkerk, May 9, 2012

nijkerk wrote:

Just wait ....how many of these fanboys will be complaining about "Canon bias" when the 5D3 gets a very good review...which it will..Photographers complaining because a camera requires good technique and the best lenses to get fantastic quality..doesnt that apply to all cameras?

It does.

By all acounts the 5D3 looks to be an excellent camera, albeit not the major leap expected after 4 years with the 5D2. Nikon just caught Canon this time - big time! But I'm sure there will be a Canon D800-like camera in the future - either it is on the way, or worse they got there eyes on it now because of Nikon, then it will take a couple of years. I was expecting and waiting on something like the D800 from Canon, so instead of the 5D3 I'll just get a used 5D2 and wait to see what happens.

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  • Jan

GaryJP
Veteran MemberPosts: 6,080Gear list
Re: Lower score than 7D and 1D MkIV
In reply to Ecniv, May 9, 2012

Ecniv wrote:

Gary, I can't believe there is such a rating difference in RAW, JPG and HIGH ISO between the D800 and 7D?? There is no doubt there bias in favor of Nikon.

The idea of an objective review is a myth anyway, so it does not worry me much.

I get rather more frustrated with the reviews that never appear, like the 1D MkIII.

Different bodies will have different strengths in different areas. Different reviewers focus on different areas. You just make your own decisions knowing these things.

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Mike Gerstner
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,581Gear list
Re: Lower score than 7D and 1D MkIV
In reply to GaryJP, May 9, 2012

fwiw.....Quote: "Scoring is relative only to the other cameras in the same category."

birdbrain
Senior MemberPosts: 3,248Gear list
Re: How dare DPR say D800 is great! Can anyone say bias
In reply to Ecniv, May 9, 2012

Ecniv wrote:

After reading all these unbiased reports from Canon users, how is it possible that DPR come to the conclusion that this camera is awesome. They haven't got a clue and are showing a great deal of bias in favor of Nikon.

Yet the D800 only gets 82% while the 7D gets 84%

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Dareshooter
Senior MemberPosts: 1,119
Re: Lower score than 7D and 1D MkIV
In reply to Ecniv, May 9, 2012

Ecniv wrote:

Gary, I can't believe there is such a rating difference in RAW, JPG and HIGH ISO between the D800 and 7D?? There is no doubt there bias in favor of Nikon.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikon-d800-d800e/28

Scroll down to the bottom of the conclusion page and read this.

"Scoring is relative only to the other cameras in the same category."

Mike Gerstner
Veteran MemberPosts: 3,581Gear list
"Scoring is relative only to the other cameras in the same category."
In reply to birdbrain, May 9, 2012

fwiw, a quote from just above the actual score

Sal Baker
Veteran MemberPosts: 7,642Gear list
Re: How dare DPR say D800 is great! Can anyone say bias
In reply to Bruce sawle, May 9, 2012

Bruce sawle wrote:

Sal Baker wrote:

Ecniv wrote:

After reading all these unbiased reports from Canon users, how is it possible that DPR come to the conclusion that this camera is awesome. They haven't got a clue and are showing a great deal of bias in favor of Nikon.

Agreed. This site is owned by Amazon which will always push the camera that has higher sales on their site. Good catch.

Notice how they didn't mention the bad AF modules, the green LCDs, the lock-up problems, and hardly touched on the live view magnification problem. This camera has some issues but they won't be mentioned in the review here.

Sal

Why would they mention any of the above if they did not encounter it. Your statement is ridiculous. Do you think a reviewer is going to mention all the tiny little issues that some users have encountered with the 5dmk III they don't encounter them durring there testing.

Yes, or they would mention the "light leak" even if they didn't encounter it. How can they ignore all the D800 threads in their own forums? And how could they not have the lock-up problem? Nikon has even admitted it is a problem in all D800s that needs a "work around." If nothing else it shows they didn't test the camera thoroughly.

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Sal Baker
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Re: How dare DPR say D800 is great! Can anyone say bias
In reply to studio311, May 9, 2012

Bias is what it is. If you can't see that you look pretty foolish too. The D800 isn't perfect but neither is the 5DIII. Nikon needs no protection from anyone in this forum, they're a grown-up company.

studio311 wrote:

Now it's a conspiracy ...really? DO you guys have ANY idea how foolish you appear? Yowsa.

Take a deep breath and consider this...the Nikon D800 is a stellar camera. Wait....wait...yep, the world still turns and Canon gear still makes great images. Shocking.

Sal Baker wrote:

Ecniv wrote:

After reading all these unbiased reports from Canon users, how is it possible that DPR come to the conclusion that this camera is awesome. They haven't got a clue and are showing a great deal of bias in favor of Nikon.

Agreed. This site is owned by Amazon which will always push the camera that has higher sales on their site. Good catch.

Notice how they didn't mention the bad AF modules, the green LCDs, the lock-up problems, and hardly touched on the live view magnification problem. This camera has some issues but they won't be mentioned in the review here.

Sal

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Jrobe
Regular MemberPosts: 417
Correst - it is not a great snapshot camera.
In reply to Ecniv, May 9, 2012

Ansel Adams would buy a D800 (probably e). If all you need is a snapshot camera, buy a Canon.

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