any hope for a X200 for photokina?

Started May 6, 2012 | Discussions
ZZ9
ZZ9
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any hope for a X200 for photokina?
May 6, 2012

i m sure fuji dont want cannibalize the X-PRO1 sales introducing a a X200 with a 16mp sensor and with a wonderful universal 35mm f2 lens

maybe this is also the reason why they didnt introduce the 35mm focal lenght couse if not there were a problem for buy the 27mm and 53mm ...too many choice

anyway autmun (photokina) will me enough mature time maybe...especially for customer dont intend to buy a X-PRO 1

what do you think? impossible?

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Brian Mosley
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I sincerely hope so, for Fuji's sake.
In reply to ZZ9, May 6, 2012

The X100 is in many ways superior to the X-Pro 1. Thinking that holding back an X200 will make things easier for the X-Pro 1 is mistaken imho... people will always find an alternative (e.g. the E-M5).

Currently, there is nothing to touch the X100 because there isn't a comparable lens for m4/3rds. If Fuji can get an X200 to market with their sublime sensor, the advantage will hold for the foreseeable future.

I think (hope) an X200 is inevitable.

Cheers

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Davidgilmour
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Re: any hope for a X200 for photokina?
In reply to ZZ9, May 6, 2012

ZZ9 wrote:

i m sure fuji dont want cannibalize the X-PRO1 sales introducing a a X200 with a 16mp sensor and with a wonderful universal 35mm f2 lens

maybe this is also the reason why they didnt introduce the 35mm focal lenght couse if not there were a problem for buy the 27mm and 53mm ...too many choice

anyway autmun (photokina) will me enough mature time maybe...especially for customer dont intend to buy a X-PRO 1

what do you think? impossible?

If Fuji can release the X-200 with the new sensor, 16MP, no AA-filter, 35mm f1.4 (effective 52mm) for € 1.099 / $ 1,199, they will sell hundredthousands of it!

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Eijnaix
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Re: I sincerely hope so, for Fuji's sake.
In reply to Brian Mosley, May 6, 2012

Kindly enlighten in which ways are the x100 more superior ?

Brian Mosley wrote:

The X100 is in many ways superior to the X-Pro 1. Thinking that holding back an X200 will make things easier for the X-Pro 1 is mistaken imho... people will always find an alternative (e.g. the E-M5).

Currently, there is nothing to touch the X100 because there isn't a comparable lens for m4/3rds. If Fuji can get an X200 to market with their sublime sensor, the advantage will hold for the foreseeable future.

I think (hope) an X200 is inevitable.

Cheers

Brian
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Re: I sincerely hope so, for Fuji's sake.
In reply to Eijnaix, May 6, 2012

Eijnaix wrote:

Kindly enlighten in which ways are the x100 more superior ?

Smaller body
Smaller lens
Quieter shutter
built in flash
faster flash sync
cheaper

Brian Mosley wrote:

The X100 is in many ways superior to the X-Pro 1. Thinking that holding back an X200 will make things easier for the X-Pro 1 is mistaken imho... people will always find an alternative (e.g. the E-M5).

Currently, there is nothing to touch the X100 because there isn't a comparable lens for m4/3rds. If Fuji can get an X200 to market with their sublime sensor, the advantage will hold for the foreseeable future.

I think (hope) an X200 is inevitable.

Cheers

Brian
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cptrios
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Re: I sincerely hope so, for Fuji's sake.
In reply to rattymouse, May 6, 2012

rattymouse wrote:

Smaller body
Smaller lens
Quieter shutter
built in flash
faster flash sync
cheaper

Ignoring the lens bit, you also just explained why the Rebel T3 is better than the 5D Mark III.

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unknown member
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Re: I sincerely hope so, for Fuji's sake.
In reply to cptrios, May 6, 2012

cptrios wrote:

rattymouse wrote:

Smaller body
Smaller lens
Quieter shutter
built in flash
faster flash sync
cheaper

Ignoring the lens bit, you also just explained why the Rebel T3 is better than the 5D Mark III.

Yeah, well for some people the Rebel T3 is a better camera than a 5D III.

My X100 is one of my all time favorite cameras. I have zero interest in an X Pro 1.

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Frederico70x7
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Re: I sincerely hope so, for Fuji's sake.
In reply to rattymouse, May 6, 2012

I pondered between X-Pro 1 and X-100 and settled on the latter because it looks nicer and is built better despite the lack of interchangeable lenses.

Although both are first generation models of their own kind by Fuji, X-100 seems more "mature" than the other in terms of features and quality. I will get an X-Pro 2 or 3 when Fuji improves the model. But for X-100, the first model already satisfied me.

Back to topic, if you want an X-200, what new features or improvements do you want to see?

I want same sensor resolution but a full frame, fixed lens (35/1.4) and faster write speed. If fuji also launches variant models with 24mm, 50mm, 90mm, I am all set!

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cptrios
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Re: I sincerely hope so, for Fuji's sake.
In reply to rattymouse, May 6, 2012

rattymouse wrote:

cptrios wrote:

rattymouse wrote:

Smaller body
Smaller lens
Quieter shutter
built in flash
faster flash sync
cheaper

Ignoring the lens bit, you also just explained why the Rebel T3 is better than the 5D Mark III.

Yeah, well for some people the Rebel T3 is a better camera than a 5D III.

My X100 is one of my all time favorite cameras. I have zero interest in an X Pro 1.

Mine too. Just pointing out how subjective everything is. I, for one, would love an exact copy of the X100 with the new 16MP sensor and a refined formula for the lens that corrected field curvature a bit better. I wouldn't change anything else apart from the obvious (i.e. improved operation speed).

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ZZ9
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52mm??? crazy
In reply to Davidgilmour, May 6, 2012

53,5mm (35x1,53 is exacly 53,5mm the X factor of the sensor is 1.53 its a totally useless focal lenght...you will never find a street photographer or reportage photographer TODAY (not 80 years ago) who will use a fixed 53mm ....

maybe a hobbist without any sense of what is composition...

If Fuji can release the X-200 with the new sensor, 16MP, no AA-filter, 35mm f1.4 (effective 52mm) for € 1.099 / $ 1,199, they will sell hundredthousands of it!

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cptrios
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Re: 52mm??? crazy
In reply to ZZ9, May 6, 2012

I'll give you that 53.5mm isn't the greatest focal length in the world...but "totally useless?" First of all, there's no such thing as a totally useless focal length. Second...is an extra 3.5mm really enough to completely destroy the classic 50mm field of view? Eesh.

Having said that, I'd much prefer a 28/1.4 (42mm equiv) over a 35/1.4. But so far the only company that's come close to obliging that desire is Panasonic with its 20/1.7, and that lens has its own big flaws.

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Mr Gadget
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Yeah, but ...
In reply to ZZ9, May 6, 2012

my hope would be that an X200 would be a real game changer.

Work with Sony to customize the wonderful 36mpx full frame sensor used in the D800, no AA filter, design a 35mm f1.8 lens optimized for the sensor like they did with the X100, and finally keep the wonderful Jpeg engine so that I can continue to enjoy great images without having to deal with RAW processing...

IMHO, it should be doable, the size of the body would have to grow some, but it still should be smaller than a Leica M9... I can only dream, until then the little X100 does a wonderful job for how I use it.
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smallcams
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Yes for "hope" w/ some changes
In reply to ZZ9, May 6, 2012

Equivalent 35mm focal length is best compromise. Best for street/general purpose/environmental portraiture.

Improve overall speed
Make menus more user friendly w/ better customization
Better AF

Also, make the battery larger. This will give us a better grip without increasing the overall footprint as the existing lens housing is still deeper than the grip.

Could they do the following without making it too much bigger?
16mp, 1.3 crop sensor
f/1.8

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hexar
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Re: Yes for "hope" w/ some changes
In reply to smallcams, May 6, 2012

I am tempted to the x100 for a while but evertime I grab one in a shop and hold it I find that I cannot coop with the ergonomics. My thumb gets naturally in a place where there are buttons. I know there are thitd party thumb rests but I wonder whynthere is not suchnas a " natural" place for my thumb. Anyone with the same experience solution ?

(i used to shoot withma konika HEXAR AF for several years and the x100 comes extremely close in shooting experience and top class built . The whole concept from those daysmwithmthe Konica keeps soooo atractive to me).

Cheers
HEXAR

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cptrios
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Re: Yes for "hope" w/ some changes
In reply to smallcams, May 6, 2012

smallcams wrote:

Could they do the following without making it too much bigger?
16mp, 1.3 crop sensor
f/1.8

Short answer: probably not. I'd love that too, but it'd be an extremely tall order. I would gladly, however, accept a slightly bulkier lens (another CM of length wouldn't bother me all that much) if they could open the aperture up to f/1.8 and leave it as an APS-C camera.

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ZZ9
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Re: 52mm??? crazy
In reply to cptrios, May 6, 2012

50mm was a standard 80 years ago, actually the 35mm ha replaced the 50mm

53,5mm its not 50mm anyway , i tried on APS-C the 35mm...and its really a pain to frame...its all exept a universal lens...

anyway not the must useless...the record of most useless lens (and as a KIT) its the pentax 40mm F2.8 in kit with the K-01

i cant imagine what was inside brain of pentax when they released this "basic KIT"
maybe nothing...

cptrios wrote:

I'll give you that 53.5mm isn't the greatest focal length in the world...but "totally useless?" First of all, there's no such thing as a totally useless focal length. Second...is an extra 3.5mm really enough to completely destroy the classic 50mm field of view? Eesh.

Having said that, I'd much prefer a 28/1.4 (42mm equiv) over a 35/1.4. But so far the only company that's come close to obliging that desire is Panasonic with its 20/1.7, and that lens has its own big flaws.

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lnbolch
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Re: Yes for "hope" w/ some changes
In reply to smallcams, May 6, 2012

smallcams wrote:

Could they do the following without making it too much bigger?
16mp, 1.3 crop sensor
f/1.8

Nope. The APS-C sensor absolutely fills the area behind the mount. The X-Mount would be history—a glance behind the lens makes that perfectly clear.

And, why? The quality I am getting is absolutely breath-taking. Even at ISO25,600, quality rivals that of my D700, comparing JPEG to RAW. The gain in going from a 1.5× to a 1.3× crop would be minimal. At lower ISO settings, it just does not get any better than this.

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cptrios
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Re: Yes for "hope" w/ some changes
In reply to lnbolch, May 6, 2012

lnbolch wrote:

And, why? The quality I am getting is absolutely breath-taking. Even at ISO25,600, quality rivals that of my D700, comparing JPEG to RAW. The gain in going from a 1.5× to a 1.3× crop would be minimal. At lower ISO settings, it just does not get any better than this.

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Yeah, for me personally the main draw of a FF sensor is pixel-level detail (which is why I'm not a huge fan of the D800), and the X100 is as good as any FF camera I've ever used in that department. As long as they'd be able to maintain that with the 16MP sensor (I haven't seen enough of it to know), there'd be no real reason to move up to a 1.3x crop.

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travelinbri_74
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Re: Yes for "hope" w/ some changes
In reply to cptrios, May 7, 2012

I am holding off on the X100 to see if an X200 comes out (although I am still strongly considering the X-Pro1). What improvements would I like? A FF sensor--as some have mentioned--would be breathtaking, and easily worth the $500 it would probably add on to the price for me (although for many, not I would think). The perfect X200 would have better AF, a 1.4 lens (I am okay for anything in real terms in the 24-50 range, preferring the wider end), and yes, weatherproofing. The notion of releasing 3 such cameras (say, a X200-24, X200-50, X200-100) would be really interesting, but I doubt we pay 2000$ a piece when you'd rather just have the lenses for cheaper. However, if the camera stays cropped--say with the excellent 16MP sensor in the X-Pro1--and the price is around 900-1100, AND they were weatherproofed... I could see a series being interesting...

But that is a tangent:

Would Like: a FF sensor, Would Need: The Excellent 16MP sensor the X-Pro 1 has
Would like: a 1.2 lens, 1.4 is also fine. Even 1.8 would be an improvement.
Would like: Better AF and weatherproofing, NEED; Somewhat better AF.

I suspect we see nothing for another year, but let's see...

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lnbolch
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Re: 52mm??? crazy
In reply to ZZ9, May 7, 2012

The definition of a normal lens has always been the equivalent of the diagonal of the frame. In the case of a 35mm camera or full frame digital camera, that would be around 43mm. Custom made it 50mm, though there have been a number of lenses up to 58mm that are considered "normal".

Any focal length is every bit as effective as the person shooting with it.

ZZ9 wrote:
50mm was a standard 80 years ago, actually the 35mm ha replaced the 50mm

53,5mm its not 50mm anyway , i tried on APS-C the 35mm...and its really a pain to frame...its all exept a universal lens...

anyway not the must useless...the record of most useless lens (and as a KIT) its the pentax 40mm F2.8 in kit with the K-01

i cant imagine what was inside brain of pentax when they released this "basic KIT"
maybe nothing...

cptrios wrote:

I'll give you that 53.5mm isn't the greatest focal length in the world...but "totally useless?" First of all, there's no such thing as a totally useless focal length. Second...is an extra 3.5mm really enough to completely destroy the classic 50mm field of view? Eesh.

Having said that, I'd much prefer a 28/1.4 (42mm equiv) over a 35/1.4. But so far the only company that's come close to obliging that desire is Panasonic with its 20/1.7, and that lens has its own big flaws.

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