Nikon is killing the local shops!

Started May 5, 2012 | Discussions
dylanear
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Nikon is killing the local shops!
May 5, 2012

Last week I declined a D800 sitting on the counter in front of me. NOT because the dealer wanted $200 over list price, but because they said I could not return the camera for ANY reason. Turn it on for the first time and it catches on fire? My problem, dealer won't do anything for me. I got to another dealer in town minutes later and I tell them the story at the other dealer and they say, "Oh we're the same, if you return it what are supposed to do with broken camera?" I thought that was the most outrageous statement! Return it to Nikon for a refund or a camera that works perhaps?! So today I'm calling a few more dealers in other cities and I tell that experience to them and they again say, "Same here" I ask them how in the universe they think that's fair and why would anyone buy from a local shop if there are 30 day no questions asked returns from internet shops and even Best Buy. This dealer took the time to talk to me and tell me their perspective. They say Nikon will not take back returns, unless it's been determined to be a factory defect and the dealer said many times that's not agreed upon between dealers and Nikon.

So with Nikon not acknowledging the AF issue on the D800, the dealers are understandingly nervous about getting stuck with a camera.

I'd think Nikon would want to support local shops with excellent return policies. The one reason I'd prefer a local shop is A: I can try the camera first, B: I can return it directly and instantly if there is an initial problem with it. BUT, it seems neither are an option at any camera store I've found in New Mexico.

Come on Nikon! Give small shops support, so they can support me!!!

Nikon D800
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Tommot1965
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 5, 2012

isnt a warranty for faulty cameras...if you buy it and its catch fire.. return it to Nikon, the shop is a dealer, not a repairer..

I still understand your frustration ...but there's many people out there that buy something new, then have buyers remorse and expect the shop to subsidise their bad decisions

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dylanear
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to Tommot1965, May 5, 2012

A warranty is for things that break on a camera during the warranty period. A prompt return is what should happen when you pay for a new camera that isn't fully functional when it came out of the box/left the factory.

Isn't that completely reasonable and pretty much what you'd expect from any electronics purchase? If you go to a local shop and by a TV and there's a big blotch on the screen when you take it out of the box at home? Do you think you should have to ship that to Sony/LG/Samsung? Or just take it back to the store to get another that works or get your money back if they don't have a working replacement to give you?

Tommot1965 wrote:

isnt a warranty for faulty cameras...if you buy it and its catch fire.. return it to Nikon, the shop is a dealer, not a repairer..

I still understand your frustration ...but there's many people out there that buy something new, then have buyers remorse and expect the shop to subsidise their bad decisions

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Tommot1965
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 5, 2012

yes I do agree ....but I dont think anyone should have a 30 day no questioned asked return policy...if the cameras broken out of the box..then yes they should take it back...and I see your point about the left AF points...but does that make a broken camera..or a warranty claim ?

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Clark Hampton
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 5, 2012

selling it for +$200 would make me go elsewhere

 Clark Hampton's gear list:Clark Hampton's gear list
Nikon D100 Nikon D200 Nikon D800 Nikon AF Nikkor 85mm f/1.8D Nikon AF Nikkor 135mm f/2D DC +4 more
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Clayton1985
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 5, 2012

I could be wrong but it sure sounds like an issue with your local shop, not Nikon.

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mwphotog
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 5, 2012

I thought authorized Nikon dealers were supposed to honor the price that Nikon set. Perhaps you are not contacting authorized dealers?

The local shop I deal with has a no-questions-asked 2 week return policy for a refund or an exchange, and they don't overcharge on the gear.

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The Andy G
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 5, 2012

I'd imagine your regional consumer protection laws have something to say about that.

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I like the colours. Your camera takes good pictures.

 The Andy G's gear list:The Andy G's gear list
Nikon D800E Nikon AF-S Nikkor 50mm f/1.4G Nikon AF Nikkor 20mm f/2.8D Nikon AF Nikkor 85mm f/1.8D Nikon AF-S Nikkor 35mm f/1.4G
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corneaboy
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to Clayton1985, May 5, 2012

Its just like everything else these days. The local shops are under huge pressure to compete with the big box stores. Furthermore, they have too many people who use them to try out the camera and then order from someone else online. We used to call that scabbing but now its seems to be standard procedure.

If you establish a good relationship with your local shop so they know you are a loyal customer, they will probably go to bat for you with Nikon. Otherwise, they spend a lot of time wasted, which costs them. Most of the local shops in our area have gone out of business.

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Dave Largent
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Nikon-set price
In reply to mwphotog, May 5, 2012

mwphotog wrote:

I thought authorized Nikon dealers were supposed to honor the price that Nikon set.

I may be wrong but isn't the Nikon-set price you mention a MINIMUM price? Authorized dealers are allowed to charge MORE and still be in compliance?

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ollehto
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to The Andy G, May 5, 2012

The Andy G wrote:

I'd imagine your regional consumer protection laws have something to say about that.

Exactly, the shops can say whatever they want but they're not above the law. With that attitude they might as well go take up fishing fulltime.

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ScottRH
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 6, 2012

The problem I have is my single only Nikon dealer, a problem itself, carries mostly cool pix since that it what sells. I shop on line.

dylanear wrote:

Last week I declined a D800 sitting on the counter in front of me. NOT because the dealer wanted $200 over list price, but because they said I could not return the camera for ANY reason. Turn it on for the first time and it catches on fire? My problem, dealer won't do anything for me. I got to another dealer in town minutes later and I tell them the story at the other dealer and they say, "Oh we're the same, if you return it what are supposed to do with broken camera?" I thought that was the most outrageous statement! Return it to Nikon for a refund or a camera that works perhaps?! So today I'm calling a few more dealers in other cities and I tell that experience to them and they again say, "Same here" I ask them how in the universe they think that's fair and why would anyone buy from a local shop if there are 30 day no questions asked returns from internet shops and even Best Buy. This dealer took the time to talk to me and tell me their perspective. They say Nikon will not take back returns, unless it's been determined to be a factory defect and the dealer said many times that's not agreed upon between dealers and Nikon.

So with Nikon not acknowledging the AF issue on the D800, the dealers are understandingly nervous about getting stuck with a camera.

I'd think Nikon would want to support local shops with excellent return policies. The one reason I'd prefer a local shop is A: I can try the camera first, B: I can return it directly and instantly if there is an initial problem with it. BUT, it seems neither are an option at any camera store I've found in New Mexico.

Come on Nikon! Give small shops support, so they can support me!!!

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cluna
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 6, 2012

Buy it with Amex and don't worry about it.
-C

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em_dee_aitch
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 6, 2012

As of nearly two years ago, I have had two different local shops that I patronize and whom I believe to be truthful with regard to this issue, one in Texas and one in California, explain to me in pretty much exactly the same terms Nikon's harsh recent changes toward local retailers. It boils down to this:

Nikon is trying to push some of the "refurb" recirculation burden off of themselves and onto the local shops. They are doing this by instituting a policy that if a customer returns a lens or body to the retailer that the retailer cannot return it to Nikon for refund/replacement but rather must submit it to Nikon Service (as a customer would) and get the same "repair" that a customer would at which point they can sell it as a refurb, or -- if they dare press their luck -- new again. In many cases this means that Nikon will check the flawed unit and return it as "within standard" even though it is clearly flawed. They do this because their "standards" are (apparently) deliberately very loose so that the refurb channel does not have to cost them a lot of money in actual testing and repair. They do not want to deal with subtle, hard-to-fix issues: they would rather just recirculate it into the hands of someone who is so happy to save 10 percent that they won't notice. The dealer's are naturally angry about this, because having to sell the unit as a refurb knocks all the profit out of it and takes time from their staff. You can bet good money that this policy is why so many people are getting bodies from major online resellers that have high actuation count already on the camera. They are just returns being sold again "as new." Some will be "buyer's remorse" units that have no real problem, but others will certainly be "within standards" unit that are junk.

... Oh, also: You be rest assured that instead of having the units that customers return as "problematic" sent in to Nikon for screening, that some retailers are simply having their own unqualified employees "check it" before reselling it to someone else.

When I first came to Nikon in 2007 the 2.8 pro zooms were in really short supply due to the D3 release, so I bought a 17-35 and a 70-200 VR1 as "salesman's sample," which is one of Nikon's euphemisms for a refurb. Both had fairly obvious flaws, the 17-35 extremely so. Nikon calibrated the problem out of the 17-35 and went so far as to replace the entire lens barrel (along with some other parts) on the 70-200 VR1 to fix it. At the time I was happy with it due to the fact that then Nikon was standing behind their refurbs in a strong way. If you look at the shops that handle a lot of refurbs now, like Cameta, you can see that the refurb warranty promised has become weaker and relies more on going through the store's repair facilitation, which means the repairer may not be Nikon, which might be a good or bad thing depending on whom they select... Anyway, as a result of knowing first hand that Nikon deliberately sends highly flawed "refurbs" out the door in combination with their backing off the warranty service, I will definitely not touch another Nikon refurb until Nikon starts really standing behind them again.

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David Hill
http://www.sanfranciscoweddingphotographer.com
San Francisco & San Jose, CA | Austin, TX
Wedding Photographer and Apparent Gearhead

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ssmumich00
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 6, 2012

By Amazon then...30 day return policy

dylanear wrote:

Last week I declined a D800 sitting on the counter in front of me. NOT because the dealer wanted $200 over list price, but because they said I could not return the camera for ANY reason. Turn it on for the first time and it catches on fire? My problem, dealer won't do anything for me. I got to another dealer in town minutes later and I tell them the story at the other dealer and they say, "Oh we're the same, if you return it what are supposed to do with broken camera?" I thought that was the most outrageous statement! Return it to Nikon for a refund or a camera that works perhaps?! So today I'm calling a few more dealers in other cities and I tell that experience to them and they again say, "Same here" I ask them how in the universe they think that's fair and why would anyone buy from a local shop if there are 30 day no questions asked returns from internet shops and even Best Buy. This dealer took the time to talk to me and tell me their perspective. They say Nikon will not take back returns, unless it's been determined to be a factory defect and the dealer said many times that's not agreed upon between dealers and Nikon.

So with Nikon not acknowledging the AF issue on the D800, the dealers are understandingly nervous about getting stuck with a camera.

I'd think Nikon would want to support local shops with excellent return policies. The one reason I'd prefer a local shop is A: I can try the camera first, B: I can return it directly and instantly if there is an initial problem with it. BUT, it seems neither are an option at any camera store I've found in New Mexico.

Come on Nikon! Give small shops support, so they can support me!!!

 ssmumich00's gear list:ssmumich00's gear list
Nikon D7000 Nikon AF-S Nikkor 24-70mm f/2.8G ED Nikon AF-S Nikkor 50mm f/1.4G Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II Nikon AF Nikkor 20mm f/2.8D +3 more
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PictPerfect
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 6, 2012

Most states have so-called lemon laws that require that a seller refund the price for an item that can't or won't be repaired. Second, Nikon wants problems taken to authorized repair centers first to ascertain if there really is a defect. Then the camera is either repaired there or sent to the factory. They don't want dealers in the middle of this although some dealers will help out. I have heard of Nikon giving refunds but not rebating any shipping charges.

The reason Amazon and other mail houses are not shipping many D800's is apparently because Nikon is favoring their bricks and mortar better dealers. I got a D800 is a week and a half from one! List price. Dealers are not supposed to scalp and they may lose their Nikon dealer status.

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gl2k
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 6, 2012

dylanear wrote:

Last week I declined a D800 sitting on the counter in front of me. NOT because the dealer wanted $200 over list price, but because they said I could not return the camera for ANY reason. Turn it on for the first time and it catches on fire? My problem, dealer won't do anything for me.

Welcome to Europe.

In most European countries, when you buy something in a store you own it and there is no way of giving it back. No matter how crappy the thing is.

Only way to return something is when you buy it via the internet.

Actually this is the main reason I cancelled my D800 preorder. Not interested in getting a half cocked cam and then sending it back and forth to Nikon. Just to get silly statements that everything works like intended.

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lanef
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to dylanear, May 6, 2012

dylanear wrote:

Last week I declined a D800 sitting on the counter in front of me. NOT because the dealer wanted $200 over list price, but because they said I could not return the camera for ANY reason. Turn it on for the first time and it catches on fire? My problem, dealer won't do anything for me. I got to another dealer in town minutes later and I tell them the story at the other dealer and they say, "Oh we're the same, if you return it what are supposed to do with broken camera?" I thought that was the most outrageous statement! Return it to Nikon for a refund or a camera that works perhaps?! So today I'm calling a few more dealers in other cities and I tell that experience to them and they again say, "Same here" I ask them how in the universe they think that's fair and why would anyone buy from a local shop if there are 30 day no questions asked returns from internet shops and even Best Buy. This dealer took the time to talk to me and tell me their perspective. They say Nikon will not take back returns, unless it's been determined to be a factory defect and the dealer said many times that's not agreed upon between dealers and Nikon.

Maybe that's why Amazon UK said "discontinued?"

So with Nikon not acknowledging the AF issue on the D800, the dealers are understandingly nervous about getting stuck with a camera.

I'd think Nikon would want to support local shops with excellent return policies. The one reason I'd prefer a local shop is A: I can try the camera first, B: I can return it directly and instantly if there is an initial problem with it. BUT, it seems neither are an option at any camera store I've found in New Mexico.

Come on Nikon! Give small shops support, so they can support me!!!

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dylanear
Senior MemberPosts: 2,297
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to Clayton1985, May 6, 2012

Clayton1985 wrote:

I could be wrong but it sure sounds like an issue with your local shop, not Nikon.

Well, I talking to the local shops it seems that if they get a returned camera it's a HUGE loss for them even if the camera was defective as shipped from Nikon. Nikon should be pretty forgiving with returns from small shops trying to support local customers. But apparently it a lot of time and effort to get Nikon to take these returns. While I can return any electronics for any reason within 30 days from Best Buy. See the sad disparity there? Big box store gives better service than a local camera shop? Why? Because Nikon's policies towards small shops.

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dylanear
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Re: Nikon is killing the local shops!
In reply to mwphotog, May 6, 2012

mwphotog wrote:

I thought authorized Nikon dealers were supposed to honor the price that Nikon set. Perhaps you are not contacting authorized dealers?

I have contacted Nikon and they said local dealers can set their own prices at will.

The local shop I deal with has a no-questions-asked 2 week return policy for a refund or an exchange, and they don't overcharge on the gear.

Talking to Nikon they said they encourage at least a week if not 2 week return policy, but that is up to the dealers. Talking to the dealers, taking a return is very costly and time consuming. Nikon doesn't make it easy. Perhaps ALL 4 dealers I've talked to in this area are just crooks and would rather force broken cameras on customers, but I'd have to believe there is something to their claims.

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