D800 mirror vibration test

Started Apr 16, 2012 | Discussions
Horshack
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D800 mirror vibration test
Apr 16, 2012

Nikon D800
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Robin Casady
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to Horshack, Apr 16, 2012

What do you expect from a cheap tripod? You need to man-up and get a Gitzo.

Interesting that 3 sec. is enough for it to settle down. I expect to be using mirror-up much more than I did with the D700.
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vincent__l
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to Horshack, Apr 16, 2012

Thanks for sharing. Looks like exposures longer than 1/80 can benefit from MLU / exposure delay. It's a little strange that your timer only exposures get increasingly more blurry as the shutter time increases, as expected. However, at 1/5s it seems to get sharper.

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tony field
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to Horshack, Apr 16, 2012

Interesting and informative.
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Astrophotographer 10
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to tony field, Apr 16, 2012

What a great post. Thanks for that.

Greg.

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cs hauser
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to vincent__l, Apr 16, 2012

vincent_ l wrote:

Looks like exposures longer than 1/80 can benefit from MLU / exposure delay.

I wonder if the blur induced by mirror vibration would be visible with hand-held exposures.

I also wonder if the blur would look anywhere near that bad for photos taken at non-macro shooting distances.

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Julian Vrieslander
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to vincent__l, Apr 16, 2012

vincent_ l wrote:

Thanks for sharing. Looks like exposures longer than 1/80 can benefit from MLU / exposure delay. It's a little strange that your timer only exposures get increasingly more blurry as the shutter time increases, as expected. However, at 1/5s it seems to get sharper.

I recall an old rule-of-thumb that the effects of shutter vibration were worst for exposures around 1/15 to 1/30 second. I don't know if that is still true for recent Nikon models.

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Horshack
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to cs hauser, Apr 16, 2012

cs hauser wrote:

vincent_ l wrote:

Looks like exposures longer than 1/80 can benefit from MLU / exposure delay.

I wonder if the blur induced by mirror vibration would be visible with hand-held exposures.

I also wonder if the blur would look anywhere near that bad for photos taken at non-macro shooting distances.

On the D7000 (which has significant mirror vibration) I could never get vibration to show up in hand-held shots. I presumed it was because the vibration harmonics were different vs. a tripod or because motion-blur from handholding outweighed the effects of mirror vibration.

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Zlik
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to Horshack, Apr 16, 2012

Thank you very much for this test. Very informative.

I imagine that it would be interesting to test several tripod + head combinations at 1/10-1/20 (the shutter speed that yields the most mirror vibration) to see if some tripods really stand out for reducing the mirror slap.

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lock
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Does this mean you are going to verify this?
In reply to Horshack, Apr 16, 2012

You now know the 100 mm macro shows it. On a tripod, it apparently demands almost the old 1/f rule to get rid of this vibration effect.

If you think handheld vibrations simply overrule the mirror/shutter vibration, you could test it, couldn't you? Same object, same camera and lens, now handheld. Most likely, you will start with higher shutter speeds. You could actually have a go with a lens VR in two modes: on and off. Would be very interesting, really !

Thanks for the work, Horshack!

lock

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lovEU
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to Horshack, Apr 16, 2012

Thanks for posting. It would be interesting to see a correspondend comparison for less pixels, taken by a D3 for example.

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regards, eric

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inasir1971
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to vincent__l, Apr 16, 2012

Thanks for the test and post - appreciated.

vincent_ l wrote:

Thanks for sharing. Looks like exposures longer than 1/80 can benefit from MLU / exposure delay. It's a little strange that your timer only exposures get increasingly more blurry as the shutter time increases, as expected. However, at 1/5s it seems to get sharper.

Just an idea - maybe the vibrations are at a frequency (substantially) below 80 Hz, and the duration for the vibration to settle lies somewhere between 0.1s and 0.2s thereby allowing a greater portion of the exposure in the stable state at 0.2s than at 0.1s? All highly dependent on camera/lens/tripod

I guess that means we should be using delayed shooting for critical shots and our AF calibration.

EDIT: Did you have VR turned on - if VR lens? Would be interesting to see if VR can counter mirror-slap on tripod (and handheld low light shots) which would fall into the 0.2 range.

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Phororhacos
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to Horshack, Apr 16, 2012

This alone is enough to crave for a high EVF that would make an end of the mirrorshake forever.

Walter
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RicksAstro
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to lovEU, Apr 16, 2012

Just resize the images by 58% (sqrt of 12mpix/36mpix) and you could see for yourself.

lovEU wrote:

Thanks for posting. It would be interesting to see a correspondend comparison for less pixels, taken by a D3 for example.

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regards, eric

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M Lammerse
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to Phororhacos, Apr 16, 2012

Well,

I have seen quite a few EVFs' the past months and none come even close to a normal viewfinder. The one in the A77 is reasonable good inside, but outside it handles especially bright highlighted scenes poorly.

Especially for macro, portrait and landscape work I personally would never want to rely on a EVF as they are there now.

Michel

Phororhacos wrote:

This alone is enough to crave for a high EVF that would make an end of the mirrorshake forever.

Walter
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surf1
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to Robin Casady, Apr 16, 2012

Thanks for the test, very interesting!

But I agree with Robin, this is equally a test of mirror vibration as it is a test of your tripod. I had a Benro once, and it did not fulfill my expectations. I tested a bunch of tripods then and you could really see the difference in sharpness. Now using a Velbon Camargue carbon tripod with Markins M3 head, as it faired as well as the Gitzo I tested and was cheaper.

Cheers, Surf

Robin Casady wrote:

What do you expect from a cheap tripod? You need to man-up and get a Gitzo.

Interesting that 3 sec. is enough for it to settle down. I expect to be using mirror-up much more than I did with the D700.
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http://www.robincasady.com/Photo/index.html

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Horshack
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to surf1, Apr 16, 2012

surf1 wrote:

Thanks for the test, very interesting!

But I agree with Robin, this is equally a test of mirror vibration as it is a test of your tripod. I had a Benro once, and it did not fulfill my expectations. I tested a bunch of tripods then and you could really see the difference in sharpness. Now using a Velbon Camargue carbon tripod with Markins M3 head, as it faired as well as the Gitzo I tested and was cheaper.

Cheers, Surf

The Benro is a Gitzo knockoff and performs equally in terms of stability.

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Horshack
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Re: Does this mean you are going to verify this?
In reply to lock, Apr 16, 2012

lock wrote:

You now know the 100 mm macro shows it. On a tripod, it apparently demands almost the old 1/f rule to get rid of this vibration effect.

If you think handheld vibrations simply overrule the mirror/shutter vibration, you could test it, couldn't you? Same object, same camera and lens, now handheld. Most likely, you will start with higher shutter speeds. You could actually have a go with a lens VR in two modes: on and off. Would be very interesting, really !

Thanks for the work, Horshack!

I might but since I already tested it on the D7000 I'm not very motivated.

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Horshack
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to vincent__l, Apr 16, 2012

vincent_ l wrote:

Thanks for sharing. Looks like exposures longer than 1/80 can benefit from MLU / exposure delay. It's a little strange that your timer only exposures get increasingly more blurry as the shutter time increases, as expected. However, at 1/5s it seems to get sharper.

This is typical based on my mirror vibration tests of other models. At lower shutter speeds the vibrations taper out during the exposure and become less noticeable.

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Horshack
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Re: D800 mirror vibration test
In reply to cs hauser, Apr 16, 2012

cs hauser wrote:

vincent_ l wrote:

Looks like exposures longer than 1/80 can benefit from MLU / exposure delay.

I also wonder if the blur would look anywhere near that bad for photos taken at non-macro shooting distances.

Macro @ MFD is pretty much a torture test for mirror vibration due to the level of magnification, along with the fact that the 100mm MP is one of the sharpest lens available for the F mount. I suspect similar results could be obtained with a long telephoto.

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