Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?

Started Apr 9, 2012 | Discussions
h2k
h2k
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Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
Apr 9, 2012

Hi, for macros i use the close-up lens Canon 250D with its good optical quality. I put it onto the Pana 14-45, a legacy Nikon 1,8/50 and i also used it nicely on a borrowed Oly 9-18; my cam is a Pana G2 for now.

But the 250D close-up lens doesn’t always get me as close I’d like; for instance, i’d love a tiny flower seedling fill the full frame.

I am aware that there are native M43 native macro lenses like 45/2,8 and Oly’s upcoming 60/2,8. I could also try a retro ring (attaching the lens’s front end to the camera body).

But for now i’d like an adapter for my existing lenses. I understand the Canon 500D close-up lens is only for tele lenses? Would the new Kenko rings (between lens and body, disabling AF, but with AF confirmation) bring me closer than the 250D? Could i put the Kenko-rings onto the Nikon adapter? Are there other hi-quality lenses bringing me closer than the 250D (available in Europe at reputable dealers)?

Thanks for all real-life experiences, especially in comparison with the 250D!

Canon EOS 500D (EOS Rebel T1i / EOS Kiss X3) Panasonic Lumix DMC-G2
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NZ Scott
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to h2k, Apr 9, 2012

h2k wrote:

Hi, for macros i use the close-up lens Canon 250D with its good optical quality. I put it onto the Pana 14-45, a legacy Nikon 1,8/50 and i also used it nicely on a borrowed Oly 9-18; my cam is a Pana G2 for now.

But the 250D close-up lens doesn’t always get me as close I’d like; for instance, i’d love a tiny flower seedling fill the full frame.

I am aware that there are native M43 native macro lenses like 45/2,8 and Oly’s upcoming 60/2,8. I could also try a retro ring (attaching the lens’s front end to the camera body).

But for now i’d like an adapter for my existing lenses. I understand the Canon 500D close-up lens is only for tele lenses? Would the new Kenko rings (between lens and body, disabling AF, but with AF confirmation) bring me closer than the 250D? Could i put the Kenko-rings onto the Nikon adapter? Are there other hi-quality lenses bringing me closer than the 250D (available in Europe at reputable dealers)?

Thanks for all real-life experiences, especially in comparison with the 250D!

I use the Marumi Achromat DHG 200 Achromat. As the number suggests, it focuses down to 200mm (I suspect that your Canon goes to 250mm).

Some pix, all from the Marumi mounted on the 40-150 ED:

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Guy Parsons
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to h2k, Apr 9, 2012

Using the add-on lenses works way better with longer host lenses. On say the Oly 40-150mm or Panasonic 45-200mm or 100-300mm lens it would be better than shorter focal lengths like the 14-45mm, which does not focus particularly close in the first place.

The 250D is +4 dioptre and the 500D is +2 dioptre, that is because the name is the focal length in millimetres and the dioptre strength is the focal length divided into 1 metre, so 1000/250=4 and 1000/500=2.

I sometimes use a Raynox 250 (+8 dioptre) on my Oly 40-150mm and that manages to do better than 1:1 with 15mm captured side to side in the frame.

Another alternative for occasional use is a cheap macro lens like a Nikon fit or Pentax fit Cosina 100mm f/3.5 macro using an appropriate adapter. That goes to 1:2 as-is and to 1:1 with its accompanying addon lens. http://www.photozone.de/pentax/368-cosina-af-100mm-f35-macro that lens also seen as Vivitar, Phoenix, Soligor and other names.

It is manual focus and manual aperture control on M4/3, but that suits usual macro work which is often rather slow in pace.

Regards............ Guy

h2k wrote:

Hi, for macros i use the close-up lens Canon 250D with its good optical quality. I put it onto the Pana 14-45, a legacy Nikon 1,8/50 and i also used it nicely on a borrowed Oly 9-18; my cam is a Pana G2 for now.

But the 250D close-up lens doesn’t always get me as close I’d like; for instance, i’d love a tiny flower seedling fill the full frame.

I am aware that there are native M43 native macro lenses like 45/2,8 and Oly’s upcoming 60/2,8. I could also try a retro ring (attaching the lens’s front end to the camera body).

But for now i’d like an adapter for my existing lenses. I understand the Canon 500D close-up lens is only for tele lenses? Would the new Kenko rings (between lens and body, disabling AF, but with AF confirmation) bring me closer than the 250D? Could i put the Kenko-rings onto the Nikon adapter? Are there other hi-quality lenses bringing me closer than the 250D (available in Europe at reputable dealers)?

Thanks for all real-life experiences, especially in comparison with the 250D!

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h2k
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to Guy Parsons, Apr 9, 2012

Hi Guy and Scott, thanks for some interesting and useful input so far!

Am still interested in other comments.

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ericN2
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to h2k, Apr 9, 2012

Other interesting comments ??.. OK...don't laugh at this.. but it just may well be a thought ...for what would certainly be the sort of price you have to pay for what is regarded as a "proper" and good Macro type lens to fit those cameras.. give at least a thought to paying what is probably little difference in cost.. buy a good S/H Oly XZ-1.. it has a Super-Macro setting that REALLY is that..you can get to literally 1cm of a subject.. and it really does give excellent Macro results..

Don't know if YOU would think it up to your standard.. but it really can be very very good indeed.. and you have a very nice little pocket camera to carry around anywhere for "free"... !!

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PSCL1
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to ericN2, Apr 9, 2012

Buy an Olympus 35mm f3.5 true macro for Four-Thirds (not m4/3) for $199-$235 new, together with MMF-2 (or maybe the new 3?) Oly original equipment adapter which maintains AF. You can also get a Rainbow Imaging non-AF adapter for about $25. Not much working distance but lens is a steal for the price, corrected for close focusing, and shorter than 40-150 or the 100 Vivitar/Cosina (which I own) suggested by another poster.

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tkbslc
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to h2k, Apr 9, 2012

Close up lenses get stronger magnification the longer the focal length. Extension tubes have stronger effect with shorter focal lengths. I'd recommend using a telephoto zoom with the 250D where you can likely go past 1:1 magnification.

the 500D is actually has weaker magnification than the 250D. The reason they recommend it for telephotos is because often the 250D provides too much magnification - but that sounds like what you want.

Edit: I just realized I gave the same advice as Guy above, but great minds think alike, right?

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clengman
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to h2k, Apr 9, 2012

How about a vivitar 90mm f/2.8 macro lens plus a 2x teleconverter plus an extension ring? Or 90mm f/2.8 macro with the vivitar 2x macro focusing teleconverter. These should take you into 2:1 to 3:1 territory... I think?

h2k wrote:

Hi, for macros i use the close-up lens Canon 250D with its good optical quality. I put it onto the Pana 14-45, a legacy Nikon 1,8/50 and i also used it nicely on a borrowed Oly 9-18; my cam is a Pana G2 for now.

But the 250D close-up lens doesn’t always get me as close I’d like; for instance, i’d love a tiny flower seedling fill the full frame.

I am aware that there are native M43 native macro lenses like 45/2,8 and Oly’s upcoming 60/2,8. I could also try a retro ring (attaching the lens’s front end to the camera body).

But for now i’d like an adapter for my existing lenses. I understand the Canon 500D close-up lens is only for tele lenses? Would the new Kenko rings (between lens and body, disabling AF, but with AF confirmation) bring me closer than the 250D? Could i put the Kenko-rings onto the Nikon adapter? Are there other hi-quality lenses bringing me closer than the 250D (available in Europe at reputable dealers)?

Thanks for all real-life experiences, especially in comparison with the 250D!

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hello world
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to h2k, Apr 9, 2012

I would recommend to go for a true 1:1 macro lens... legacy is fine.

Just get a tripod, I dont own any... it on my shortlist... It's amazingly difficult to hold the camera still @ macro distances... This took me around 6 shots, and it's still not sharp but the best of the set... this little flower is about 1 cm in dia, cropped a little bit, but not much;

h2k wrote:

Hi, for macros i use the close-up lens Canon 250D with its good optical quality. I put it onto the Pana 14-45, a legacy Nikon 1,8/50 and i also used it nicely on a borrowed Oly 9-18; my cam is a Pana G2 for now.

But the 250D close-up lens doesn’t always get me as close I’d like; for instance, i’d love a tiny flower seedling fill the full frame.

I am aware that there are native M43 native macro lenses like 45/2,8 and Oly’s upcoming 60/2,8. I could also try a retro ring (attaching the lens’s front end to the camera body).

But for now i’d like an adapter for my existing lenses. I understand the Canon 500D close-up lens is only for tele lenses? Would the new Kenko rings (between lens and body, disabling AF, but with AF confirmation) bring me closer than the 250D? Could i put the Kenko-rings onto the Nikon adapter? Are there other hi-quality lenses bringing me closer than the 250D (available in Europe at reputable dealers)?

Thanks for all real-life experiences, especially in comparison with the 250D!

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nickoly
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Cheapo solution
In reply to h2k, Apr 9, 2012

I understand the Canon 250 is a +4 dioptre close-up lens, but that is not close enough. The Nikon 50mm you have can be pressed into service on the 14-45 as a high-quality +20 dioptre close-up lens. All you need is a filter thread reversing ring for about $5.

Magnification would be about 1:1.1

Attatching the lens's front to the camera body will get you nowhere.

h2k wrote:

Hi, for macros i use the close-up lens Canon 250D with its good optical quality. I put it onto the Pana 14-45, a legacy Nikon 1,8/50 and i also used it nicely on a borrowed Oly 9-18; my cam is a Pana G2 for now.

But the 250D close-up lens doesn’t always get me as close I’d like; for instance, i’d love a tiny flower seedling fill the full frame.

I am aware that there are native M43 native macro lenses like 45/2,8 and Oly’s upcoming 60/2,8. I could also try a retro ring (attaching the lens’s front end to the camera body).

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Deusex
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to h2k, Apr 9, 2012

I use M43 macro lens 45/2,8 and it work perfectly. You can add extension tube if you want bigger magnification.

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h2k
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to Deusex, Apr 9, 2012

Hi everybody, thanks for a lot of interesting and in-depth input again! Now you gave me something to think about.

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Guy Parsons
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to h2k, Apr 9, 2012

For really close macro and using a host tele zoom lens then the Raynox 250 or maybe 150 are worth experimenting with.

Danny 'nzmacro' has long decided that the Raynox 250 (+8 dioptre) on a 45-200mm lens is the way to go, here's some examples http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1041&message=38953070

Otherwise the toylike construction but good optically Cosina 100mm f/3.5 macro lens adapted is a useful choice.

Regards......... Guy

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Fredrik Glckner
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to h2k, Apr 9, 2012

I think that the best & easiest way to get very, very close macro, is to use a reverser ring. The basic Lumix G 14-42mm kit lens reversed at 14mm gives 2.5x magnification rate, which is very, very close.

At 42mm, it gives about 1.2x magnification rate, so you can zoom to change the macro reproduction rate.

A reverser ring can be bought from Ebay for about US$10.

You can read more about the process and see example image here:

http://m43photo.blogspot.com/2012/02/reverser-ring-for-macro.html

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Vlad S
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In reply to h2k, Apr 9, 2012

h2k wrote:

But the 250D close-up lens doesn’t always get me as close I’d like; for instance, i’d love a tiny flower seedling fill the full frame.

You can also attach two lenses together front-to-front. Then the magnification ratio will be FL(cam)/FL(free), where (cam) is the lens mounted on the camera, and (free) is the lens attached to it. For example, here is an uncropped image of the black pepper and cumin seeds taken with 45-200mm lens on camera at 200mm, and 50mm lens attached to the front (4x magnification):

I also have a picture that shows individual cells in the onion skin.

I held these lenses together with packing tape, so if you have lenses that could work you can try it without buying the adapters. You will need a lot of light though, and the working distance and DOF are tiny - the working distance is about the same as the distance between the back of the lens and the film plane inside the camera. But for many inanimate objects it works fine.

Vlad

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Vlad S
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In reply to Vlad S, Apr 9, 2012

These are uncropped images taken with 45-200mm zoom and 50mm reverse mounted on it.

Sugar crystals, the zoom is at 97mm, so about 2x magnification:

Onion skin, zoom at 200mm, 4x magnification:

Vlad

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SterlingBjorndahl
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In reply to h2k, Apr 10, 2012

You can often find on eBay a second hand bellows for legacy Pentax screw-mount "M42" lenses. Just search for "Pentax bellows". And old 50mm Pentax lenses are abundant as well.

It's a very inexpensive way to get great magnification. Of course, the focus and aperture are only manual, but if you're using a tripod and setting up the lighting anyway, that's not a big deal.

Sterling
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h2k
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to h2k, Apr 14, 2012

Hi all, thanks again for all old and new suggestions and pictures! After some pondering your recommendations i came to the conclusion that in my situation i would prefer one of these solutions:

  • a hi-quality macro front adapter stronger than Canon 250D – any suggestions?

  • a native m43 macro lens like the Pana 2,8/45 (I am currently borrowing one and started a new thread about it)

One thing is that bokeh is relevant for my pictures, and i love my Nikon 50 mm’s bokeh. It stays the same with the 250D on top. With different lenses, i don’t know.

I would also like a super wide angle for low angle wild flower close-ups that show a dominant (tiny) flower and lot of landscape behind it. I tried the Oly 9-18, but did not get close enough with the 250D and besides, the bokeh was ghastly. I didn’t try so far the Pana 7-14 because it is very bulky, expensive and doesn’t have a filter thread. The Oly 12 mm might be not wide enough. A fixed 7 or 9 mm lens that could be coupled with a macro front adapter would be my dream.

Thanks again!

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jeffharris
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Re: Macro: How to get closer than with close-up adapter 250D ?
In reply to h2k, Apr 14, 2012

h2k wrote:

Hi all, thanks again for all old and new suggestions and pictures! After some pondering your recommendations i came to the conclusion that in my situation i would prefer one of these solutions:

  • a hi-quality macro front adapter stronger than Canon 250D – any suggestions?

  • a native m43 macro lens like the Pana 2,8/45 (I am currently borrowing one and started a new thread about it)

Why not adapt a manual macro lens? Manual focus is preferable for macro shooting and a used lens will cost considerably less than the PL45mm. I have Nikon 60mm f2.8D (eBay $300) that's an excellent 1:1 macro and doubles as a short telephoto. There are also Nikon 55mm f2.8 and f3.5 macro lenses. I also have a Nikon 105mm f2.8 (1:2) macro that I use for flying critters.

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