Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again

Started Mar 3, 2012 | Discussions
cs hauser
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Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
Mar 3, 2012

Over the past 4 years, all we ever heard on this forum were..

  • People ridiculing Canon's 5D2 for its archaic 9-pt AF system

  • People begging Canon to put the 1-series AF system on the next 5D

  • People demanding Canon put pro features like weather sealing & redundant memory ports on a 5D

  • People scoffing at Canon's penchant for leading the megapixel race with every new sensor

  • People complaining about Canon falling behind in high ISO

  • People crying to Canon about banding on their sensors

  • People begging Canon to finally make a fast camera with a full frame sensor

  • People dreaming of the mythical EOS 3D, or at least a Canon equivalent to the Nikon D700

So Canon listened intently to what people on these forums have been saying since 2008. And now the 5D3 feature set is a virtual checklist of almost every   single   thing people have been endlessly whining about for the past four years.

That's not even an opinion. That's just a fact. Anybody with a memory that can reach further back than Feb 7, 2012 can see that as clearly as I do. The 10 most popular complaints people had about the 5D2, are the same 10 things that headline the 5D3 feature set. But here's the kicker:

In the four years since 2008, was there even ONE person in this forum that said:

...what the 5D2 really needs is MORE megapixels!

Those who are unhappy with the 5D3 specifications shouldn't blame Canon. They should blame the people who have spent the past 4 years telling Canon what the 5D3 should look like. If you look in a mirror, chances are you may recognize one of them. If you don't see one in the mirror, then just click any one of those ubiquitous 5D3 disappointment threads. You'll definitely find a lot of them over there.

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LMCasey
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

Where do you mention DR, because that's always. been my problem with 5d and MKII.

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zerozeronine
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In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

And it seems like Nikon's been listening to their users too, which is also a good thing.

This round of full-frame cameras all look great (and it's also been bonus for comparisons because they all came out at the same time). The 5D III is more well-rounded, but if you have great lenses and don't have as much need for action, the D800 is very appealing too.

I've stayed in the Canon camp because of the lenses, but now that Canon will be coming out with a stellar 24-70 II and 200-400, there's really nothing to envy in Nikon's side other than the 14-24.

Kaz

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russbarnes
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

There's no doubt they listened. But what they also did was apply such a massive price premium to that list that they instantly created a huge wave of dissatisfaction in their customer base and presided over one of the most negative product launches I've seen for a camera as a result. Incredible that they managed to turn an apparent success story into such a perceived failure at launch....the level of greed here seems to have finally been largely rejected or Canon look to me like they have wholly underestimated the level of their product in the market. One way or the other, if it's too expensive then people won't buy - I expect to see price reductions very soon.

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Bassman2003
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

Good post and true. The proof will be in the RAW pudding for me. Looking at the D4 comparison shots just posted the 5DMKII holds its own in the lower ISOs. 800 on up the D4 pulls out but not in an earth shattering way. It will interesting to see the MKIII.

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Great Bustard
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In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

cs hauser wrote:

In the four years since 2008, was there even ONE person in this forum that said:

...what the 5D2 really needs is MORE megapixels!

Yeah -- a bunch of us have been saying exactly that.

Those who are unhappy with the 5D3 specifications shouldn't blame Canon. They should blame the people who have spent the past 4 years telling Canon what the 5D3 should look like. If you look in a mirror, chances are you may recognize one of them. If you don't see one in the mirror, then just click any one of those ubiquitous 5D3 disappointment threads. You'll definitely find a lot of them over there.

First of all, Canon doesn't listen to DPR Forums. Secondly, if there's something about the 5D3 that makes it "deserve" a $500 higher price tag over the D800, Canon's doing a good job keeping it secret.

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mgifotografie
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

Canon has listened well. Spec wise it is an excellent allround fullframe cam....one big dissatisfier is the introduction price: approx. 3500 eur.

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expro
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

two things that you have noticed but not really realised what it means:

1. yes they have improved 5d2 to 5d3 with what most people wanted.... but that took 4 years of waiting and frustration, and now the world has moved on ...but not Canon it seems...

2. They have severely misspriced an old functional set... body $4700 in UK! More than $1000 over 5d2 launch street price....

however, the redeeming feature is that they may yet have nailed the performance so well that the camera still sells... time will tell

and since I own 11 L lenses I hope they have got it right or there is a 3d around the corner...please!

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MM1
MM1
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

Personally, I am very happy. With the exception of price, where I spent significant budget on 1D3 body not too long ago, so now this new 5D is definitely out of my reach. But there will be time where its price and my budget matches and then I'll buy it. Provided the AF matches 1D3 in one-shot. Which shouldn't be that hard to do, I hope, for this new 61pt AF

Btw, I agree with most of the below complaints about 5D2, and I am glad they listened.

cs hauser wrote:
Over the past 4 years, all we ever heard on this forum were..

  • People ridiculing Canon's 5D2 for its archaic 9-pt AF system

  • People begging Canon to put the 1-series AF system on the next 5D

  • People demanding Canon put pro features like weather sealing & redundant memory ports on a 5D

  • People scoffing at Canon's penchant for leading the megapixel race with every new sensor

  • People complaining about Canon falling behind in high ISO

  • People crying to Canon about banding on their sensors

  • People begging Canon to finally make a fast camera with a full frame sensor

  • People dreaming of the mythical EOS 3D, or at least a Canon equivalent to the Nikon D700

So Canon listened intently to what people on these forums have been saying since 2008. And now the 5D3 feature set is a virtual checklist of almost every   single   thing people have been endlessly whining about for the past four years.

That's not even an opinion. That's just a fact. Anybody with a memory that can reach further back than Feb 7, 2012 can see that as clearly as I do. The 10 most popular complaints people had about the 5D2, are the same 10 things that headline the 5D3 feature set. But here's the kicker:

In the four years since 2008, was there even ONE person in this forum that said:

...what the 5D2 really needs is MORE megapixels!

Those who are unhappy with the 5D3 specifications shouldn't blame Canon. They should blame the people who have spent the past 4 years telling Canon what the 5D3 should look like. If you look in a mirror, chances are you may recognize one of them. If you don't see one in the mirror, then just click any one of those ubiquitous 5D3 disappointment threads. You'll definitely find a lot of them over there.

-- hide signature --

Cheers,
Martin

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Flying Fish
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Yes and no
In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

I think you're basically right, but the D800 did change people's perceptions of MP number, at least for now, at least until we can compare images. Second, the price rise puzzles me. I'll listen to arguments that the Canon 5D3 is as good as the Nikon D800, but I'm having a hard time thinking that it's $500 better .

FF

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pso
pso
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In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

Canon did listen...this new cam looks phenomenal. As others pointed out, the price point being 500 USD higher than D800 for me at least, has made me reluctant to spring on this camera. I will vote with my money this time.

With that said...how the heck did they justify sticking the same ridiculous tight diamond af pattern on the 2nd 5D in the first place? OK OK enough of the past. ; )

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Pak K So
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VivaLasVegas
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Re: Amen
In reply to zerozeronine, Mar 3, 2012

zerozeronine wrote:

there's really nothing to envy in Nikon's side other than the 14-24.

Kaz

Believe me when the EF 14-24 f2.8 is release, Nikkor 14-24 f2.8 will look soft, just like their 24-70 & 70-200.

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ScottyNV
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to expro, Mar 3, 2012

expro wrote:

two things that you have noticed but not really realised what it means:

1. yes they have improved 5d2 to 5d3 with what most people wanted.... but that took 4 years of waiting and frustration, and now the world has moved on ...but not Canon it seems...

get your timeline straight.. the 5D2 was announced in September of 2008, with delivery beginning at the beginning of December 2008.. not 4 years yet.

2. They have severely misspriced an old functional set... body $4700 in UK! More than $1000 over 5d2 launch street price....

again, get your pricing correct.. the original price for the 5D was $3200 CDN, and the 5D2 was suggested at $2700CDN with a retail price of $3200CDN...

however, the redeeming feature is that they may yet have nailed the performance so well that the camera still sells... time will tell

and since I own 11 L lenses I hope they have got it right or there is a 3d around the corner...please!

S.
--
beam me up captain, there's no intelligent life down here!

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zerozeronine
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In reply to VivaLasVegas, Mar 3, 2012

But Canon's 16-35 II was a bit underwhelming, and I read somewhere that the dimensions of Canon's EF mount make it a bit harder to make better wide angle lenses?

But, hey, I'd be elated if they nail the 14-24 too. The 14-200 range covered by essentially-perfect fast zooms.

Kaz

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Techblast
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to LMCasey, Mar 3, 2012

That has been answered as well with the new sensor. You also can shoot HDR up to 7 frames in a bracket and that is a huge boon to this type of photography.

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Peter 13
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

cs hauser wrote:

So Canon listened intently to what people on these forums have been saying since 2008. And now the 5D3 feature set is a virtual checklist of almost every   single   thing people have been endlessly whining about for the past four years.

The key word is four years .

In the four years since 2008, was there even ONE person in this forum that said:

...what the 5D2 really needs is MORE megapixels!

It is 2012 now.

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Techblast
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Re: Yes and no
In reply to Flying Fish, Mar 3, 2012

Hold onto your hat. The real proof is about to be revealed. No use speculating anymore. In about 30-45 days we'll be able to see images and determine which image has the best detail and IQ.

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expro
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to ScottyNV, Mar 3, 2012

thanks for the correction on timing. I got mine in dec 08.

however, with pricing I'm spot on uk prices.... you should know Canon just takes the p..s out of UK consumers.... nothing to do with exchange rates either..

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LMCasey
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to Techblast, Mar 3, 2012

What about the sensor itself? If the sensor doesn't have higher DR, then the camera has not improved over the Mk2. I can already do HDR in software. I want DR with no issues with subject movement.

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svenler
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Re: Don't ever say "Canon Doesn't Listen" ever again
In reply to cs hauser, Mar 3, 2012

cs hauser wrote:

So Canon listened intently to what people on these forums have been saying since 2008. And now the 5D3 feature set is a virtual checklist of almost every   single   thing people have been endlessly whining about for the past four years.

You are missing that people mentioned these issues as faults of a camera in 2008. Now in 2012, most expected these faults to be fixed and then some.

I am waiting to see real world samples of production models, but the samples Canon is providing at the moment look less than promising.

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