Canon T3 has brutal color banding, why?

Started Nov 13, 2011 | Discussions
IcyVeins
Senior MemberPosts: 1,342Gear list
Like?
Canon T3 has brutal color banding, why?
Nov 13, 2011

in DPR's RAW test shots, even at ISO 100, there is serious diagonal color banding on the face next to the red text, to the left of the queen of hearts. Why does it show up there? Why only on the face and no other place (that I can tell)? The Nikon D3100 has the same problem, though the bands are thinner, but just as obvious. It seems like it would be difficult to correct in PP because even if you remove the color noise, I'd think the banding would still be visible. Also not to mention that color noise at ISO 100 is pretty LOL.

This problem doesn't seem to occur on any other current DSLRs, nor even on any mirrorless cameras that I have looked at. Only those two. In my opinion this is a serious problem with imave quality that if present in enough situations, would make these both of these cameras almost unusable in RAW. What is the explanation for this problem?

 IcyVeins's gear list:IcyVeins's gear list
Sony Cyber-shot DSC-W290
Canon EOS 1100D (EOS Rebel T3 / EOS Kiss X50) Nikon D3100
If you believe there are incorrect tags, please send us this post using our feedback form.
brightcolours
Veteran MemberPosts: 8,622
Like?
Re: Canon T3 has brutal color banding, why?
In reply to IcyVeins, Nov 13, 2011

IcyVeins wrote:

in DPR's RAW test shots, even at ISO 100, there is serious diagonal color banding on the face next to the red text, to the left of the queen of hearts. Why does it show up there? Why only on the face and no other place (that I can tell)? The Nikon D3100 has the same problem, though the bands are thinner, but just as obvious. It seems like it would be difficult to correct in PP because even if you remove the color noise, I'd think the banding would still be visible. Also not to mention that color noise at ISO 100 is pretty LOL.

Diagonal? I guess you mean the VERICAL stripes?

That most probably is from the subject itself, has nothing to do with the EOS 600D or D3100 then. Other high resolution sensors/cameras with not too heavy AA-filters show it too, like the Sony A77.

This problem doesn't seem to occur on any other current DSLRs, nor even on any mirrorless cameras that I have looked at. Only those two. In my opinion this is a serious problem with imave quality that if present in enough situations, would make these both of these cameras almost unusable in RAW. What is the explanation for this problem?

So you know enough situations where you shoot badly designed back notes, do you?

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
IcyVeins
Senior MemberPosts: 1,342Gear list
Like?
Re: Canon T3 has brutal color banding, why?
In reply to brightcolours, Nov 14, 2011

Lol have you even looked at any of the test imgaes I'm referring to? And you are really suggesting the T3 and D3100 are high resolution cameras? They are essentially the lowest resolution current DSLRs on the market. The A77 is the highest. It's almost like you meant to say that the low resolution is to blame for the color banding, instead of the high resolution. But maybe you could clarify. I find it curious that you are blaming the subject. The bottom line is those cameras could not capture it and the other DSLRs could, including the A77. And it's not vertical banding, it's diagonal, albeit at a steep angle.

 IcyVeins's gear list:IcyVeins's gear list
Sony Cyber-shot DSC-W290
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Lemming51
Forum ProPosts: 12,471Gear list
Like?
It's a printed banknote. Not banding, but moire.
In reply to IcyVeins, Nov 14, 2011

The patterns in the banknote don't quite align with the sensor pixel grid, creating moire. The difference is due to the number of pixels (will be stronger effect with fewer than with more) and how strong the anti-alias filter is.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/CanonEOS1100D/page16.asp
http://www.dpreview.com/learn/?/Glossary/Digital_Imaging/Moire_01.htm

-- hide signature --

Unapologetic Canon Apologist

 Lemming51's gear list:Lemming51's gear list
Canon EOS 40D Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II Canon EF-S 15-85mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM +5 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Iron Mike
Regular MemberPosts: 154Gear list
Like?
Re: It's a printed banknote. Not banding, but moire.
In reply to Lemming51, Nov 14, 2011

Lemming51 wrote:

The patterns in the banknote don't quite align with the sensor pixel grid, creating moire. The difference is due to the number of pixels (will be stronger effect with fewer than with more) and how strong the anti-alias filter is.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/CanonEOS1100D/page16.asp
http://www.dpreview.com/learn/?/Glossary/Digital_Imaging/Moire_01.htm

That was my impression as well. Interestingly, when I looked at the 5D II in the same area I also observed the same vertical pattern. The 5D II has more resolution than any of the other cameras in the comparison though... It seems the canon sensors (in combination with their AA filters) may be a little more susceptible to this phenomenon. (speculation).

 Iron Mike's gear list:Iron Mike's gear list
Canon EOS 7D Canon EF 28mm f/1.8 USM Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 USM Canon EF 400mm f/5.6L USM Canon EF-S 15-85mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM +1 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Shorthand
Senior MemberPosts: 2,962Gear list
Like?
Re: Canon T3 has brutal color banding, why?
In reply to IcyVeins, Nov 14, 2011

You're definitely seeing moire.

Looking at the link above, the Nikon D3100 is MUCH worse than the T3. The T2i is also somewhat worse than the T3, though the pattern is much more fine grained in this instance.

The last Canon that had an adequately strong AA filter (i.e. strong enough to truly eliminate moire) was the T1i & 50D. However, my understanding is that industry feedback pushed Canon to weaken the AA filters so that the output from the sensors would appear sharper.

Pull up the image from the 500D / T1i.

However, the T1i was really hit hard for its perceived performance at the time compared to the Nikon D5000. The T2i really regained a huge "street cred" advantage though its upgrades over the T1i were really pretty minor - something like 1/3rd stop better RAW performance at high ISO (and substantial improvements to JPEG processing). Much of the perceived improvement is actually a result of the weaker AA filter. However, this is why one doesn't actually want a weak AA filter.

 Shorthand's gear list:Shorthand's gear list
Canon PowerShot G9 Sony RX100 Canon EOS 300D Canon EOS 450D Canon EOS 500D +8 more
Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
brightcolours
Veteran MemberPosts: 8,622
Like?
Re: Canon T3 has brutal color banding, why?
In reply to IcyVeins, Nov 16, 2011

The T3i, the D5100, the A77, the 7D, all show the same. Like I said, you are seeing low AA-filter and higher res sensors, all showing a similar aliasing pattern from a printed back note. Again. If this is a big problem for you, that then you must be shooting mainly badly designed bank notes?

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Keyboard shortcuts:
FForum MMy threads