HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.

Started Apr 6, 2011 | Discussions
Daniel Lowe
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HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
Apr 6, 2011

Here is a series of pics comparing the HS20 in 'SN' EXR mode with the Panasonic FZ35 and LX5.
The pics are at ISO 100,400,800,1600, and 3200 for the HS20 & LX5.
I used custom white balance for all cams, the Panasonic's were in 'P' mode.

I have matched the colour as best as I can, I did this by using the 'Velvia' film mode on the HS20 which seemed to best match the Panasonic colour (I assume this is ok for a fair test?)
Some very, very interesting results!!

Lets just say I like my new Fuji!!

Please feel free to crop/compare the images, I am kind of hoping someone will do that bit for me

Daniel Lowe
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Daniel Lowe, Apr 6, 2011

Just realised that the LX5 was at -1/3 EV!!
Arggghhh!
Does anyone know if this will seriously affect the results?

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Larry Winters
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Daniel Lowe, Apr 6, 2011

Hello Daniel:

Lets just say I like my new Fuji!!

Was there ever any doubt with the way you've been promoting the HS20 the past few weeks?...I mean seriously if the HS20 had looked terrible would you have even shown them?

The HS20 does handle the noise the best as expected but the FZ35 appears a tad sharper up to ISO 400, but overall from these less than ideal size samples the HS20 does looks formidable...Are the actual full size samples available for download?

I just wish some more real World landscape samples would show up as I don't plan on taking too many bottle, comb, battery, calendar and or cell phone pics...

lw

Daniel Lowe wrote:

Here is a series of pics comparing the HS20 in 'SN' EXR mode with the Panasonic FZ35 and LX5.
The pics are at ISO 100,400,800,1600, and 3200 for the HS20 & LX5.
I used custom white balance for all cams, the Panasonic's were in 'P' mode.

I have matched the colour as best as I can, I did this by using the 'Velvia' film mode on the HS20 which seemed to best match the Panasonic colour (I assume this is ok for a fair test?)
Some very, very interesting results!!

Lets just say I like my new Fuji!!

Please feel free to crop/compare the images, I am kind of hoping someone will do that bit for me

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Daniel Lowe
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Larry Winters, Apr 6, 2011

Larry Winters wrote:
Hello Daniel:

Lets just say I like my new Fuji!!

Was there ever any doubt with the way you've been promoting the HS20 the past few weeks?...I mean seriously if the HS20 had looked terrible would you have even shown them?

Actually Larry, it wasn't until I wrote this post and stacked the images up that I saw the real comparisons for what they are, I did the test with the sole purpose of seeing whether my hunch was correct, and I think it was. I have no other agenda.

The HS20 does handle the noise the best as expected but the FZ35 appears a tad sharper up to ISO 400, but overall from these less than ideal size samples the HS20 does looks formidable...Are the actual full size samples available for download?

I personally think the FZ is struggling to match the HS20 at ISO 100, did you click on the images to make them larger? they should be full size JPEGS.

I just wish some more real World landscape samples would show up as I don't plan on taking too many bottle, comb, battery, calendar and or cell phone pics...

Well this is usually how the pro's pixel peep, I will get you some landscape shots as soon as possible

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Larry Winters
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Daniel Lowe, Apr 6, 2011

Daniel:

I personally think the FZ is struggling to match the HS20 at ISO 100, did you click on the images to make them larger? they should be full size JPEGS.

I clicked them twice to get up to 1600x1200, but that's a 2mp image, not full size...maybe I'm missing something..

Hey, I'm glad you're enjoying the HS20...It just has too many compromises for me...

Peace...

lw

Daniel Lowe wrote:

Larry Winters wrote:
Hello Daniel:

Lets just say I like my new Fuji!!

Was there ever any doubt with the way you've been promoting the HS20 the past few weeks?...I mean seriously if the HS20 had looked terrible would you have even shown them?

Actually Larry, it wasn't until I wrote this post and stacked the images up that I saw the real comparisons for what they are, I did the test with the sole purpose of seeing whether my hunch was correct, and I think it was. I have no other agenda.

The HS20 does handle the noise the best as expected but the FZ35 appears a tad sharper up to ISO 400, but overall from these less than ideal size samples the HS20 does looks formidable...Are the actual full size samples available for download?

I personally think the FZ is struggling to match the HS20 at ISO 100, did you click on the images to make them larger? they should be full size JPEGS.

I just wish some more real World landscape samples would show up as I don't plan on taking too many bottle, comb, battery, calendar and or cell phone pics...

Well this is usually how the pro's pixel peep, I will get you some landscape shots as soon as possible

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SHood
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Daniel Lowe, Apr 6, 2011

Yes, that can make a difference. In all of the comparisons the HS20EXR is slightly more exposed (brighter) than the other two. This will give a slight advantage to the HS20. Cameras can also have slightly different ISO rating so it is best to match the aperture and shutter speed and then adjust the EV to match the exposure.

Daniel Lowe wrote:

Just realised that the LX5 was at -1/3 EV!!
Arggghhh!
Does anyone know if this will seriously affect the results?

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jcmarfilph
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Daniel Lowe, Apr 6, 2011

Awesome comparison, though it would be best if all parameters are the same. Do not use P-Mode.

At any rate, FZ35 can catch up up to ISO-400. Beyond that is a head-to-head between LX5 and HS20 but at ISO-3200 HS20 is a kicker.

Oh don't forget the ugly yellow stains of Panasonic cams.

Thanks for sharing my friend.

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adhemar
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Larry Winters, Apr 6, 2011

I clicked them twice to get up to 1600x1200, but that's a 2mp image, not full size...maybe I'm missing something...

I believe we should be able to get the full size image by clicking on the link above the image, but the only thing I get is the following error message "The remote server refuses to perform the request." I assume it has something to do with your gallery settings.

Still, i am suitably impressed by the HS20 result.

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Daniel Lowe
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to adhemar, Apr 6, 2011

I changed the settings, you should be able to download them now.

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Stephen 06
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to jcmarfilph, Apr 6, 2011

jcmarfilph wrote:

Beyond that is a head-to-head between LX5 and HS20 but at ISO-3200 HS20 is a kicker.

really?...then you are not looking at thing objectively.

1) First, he openly admitted that he underexposed the LX5. Even the slightest of underexposure can have a detrimental effect on noise on thes tiny sensors. I would have taken those images down straight away and re-shot them as they are now misleading.

2) you are looking at ISO for ISO. Example: You probably looked at the HS20 at ISO 1600 and the LX5 at ISO1600 and said to yourself "hmmm...they are head to head". When in fact in real world use, the fast lens of the LX5 will allow you to shoot at ISO640. At the very least you should compared the LX5 ISO800's image against the HS20's ISO1600 to get a real world perspective...and even at that you are still looking at the LX5's image at a disadvantage.
--
Stephen

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Daniel Lowe
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Corrected LX5 ISO 400, 800
In reply to Daniel Lowe, Apr 6, 2011

Here is the LX5 with the EV corrected:

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jcmarfilph
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Stephen 06, Apr 6, 2011

Stephen 06 wrote:

jcmarfilph wrote:

Beyond that is a head-to-head between LX5 and HS20 but at ISO-3200 HS20 is a kicker.

really?...then you are not looking at thing objectively.

1) First, he openly admitted that he underexposed the LX5. Even the slightest of underexposure can have a detrimental effect on noise on thes tiny sensors. I would have taken those images down straight away and re-shot them as they are now misleading.

2) you are looking at ISO for ISO. Example: You probably looked at the HS20 at ISO 1600 and the LX5 at ISO1600 and said to yourself "hmmm...they are head to head". When in fact in real world use, the fast lens of the LX5 will allow you to shoot at ISO640. At the very least you should compared the LX5 ISO800's image against the HS20's ISO1600 to get a real world perspective...and even at that you are still looking at the LX5's image at a disadvantage.
--
Stephen

That is why I have asked him if he could shoot with the same parameters, first because the FZ35 is in P-Mode, second the LX5 using -EV.

And why would you compare HS20's 1600 to LX5's ISO-800 knowing LX5's sensor is bigger and faster?

I'd say compare HS20's ISO-800 and LX5's ISO-1600 if that is your perspective of real-world testing.

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adhemar
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Daniel Lowe, Apr 6, 2011

Daniel Lowe wrote:

I changed the settings, you should be able to download them now.

Yes, it works.

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Daniel Lowe
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Stephen 06, Apr 6, 2011

I have posted the corrected images for the LX5, and to be honest, it didn't seem to make much difference.

You make some valid points there, but quite frankly, a superzoom getting even close to LX5 output is something pretty special.

And I can tell you right now, the HS20 is absolutely doing a better job than the FZ35, which is arguably the benchmark for superzoom image quality.

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Gary Hunt
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Daniel Lowe, Apr 6, 2011

I would leave the testing to the Pro's, nothing worse than home made testing it's so hit & miss.

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Daniel Lowe
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to jcmarfilph, Apr 6, 2011

The LX5 is, in real world shooting, not doing all that much better than the HS20 in low light.

And shooting in dim light around my house, the HS20 is simply running rings around my FZ35.

I want to test them out doors in good light next, the Panasonic's are always power houses in those conditions.

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jimr
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Stephen 06, Apr 6, 2011

The mere fact that a super zoom with its vastly more capable zoom range can compete with the LX 5 that has a so much more limiting zoom range speaks volumes about the Fuji's IQ...
Kudos to Fuji!

Stephen 06 wrote:

jcmarfilph wrote:

Beyond that is a head-to-head between LX5 and HS20 but at ISO-3200 HS20 is a kicker.

really?...then you are not looking at thing objectively.

1) First, he openly admitted that he underexposed the LX5. Even the slightest of underexposure can have a detrimental effect on noise on thes tiny sensors. I would have taken those images down straight away and re-shot them as they are now misleading.

2) you are looking at ISO for ISO. Example: You probably looked at the HS20 at ISO 1600 and the LX5 at ISO1600 and said to yourself "hmmm...they are head to head". When in fact in real world use, the fast lens of the LX5 will allow you to shoot at ISO640. At the very least you should compared the LX5 ISO800's image against the HS20's ISO1600 to get a real world perspective...and even at that you are still looking at the LX5's image at a disadvantage.
--
Stephen

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Daniel Lowe
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Gary Hunt, Apr 6, 2011

Gary Hunt wrote:

I would leave the testing to the Pro's, nothing worse than home made testing it's so hit & miss.

People really don't want this cam to be any good do they :).

My test had them all on the same tripod, the same position, the same artificial lighting at night, the same subject, the same piece of white paper for custom white balance.

I had the Panasonic's on P and the HS20 was in an EXR equivalent. The cameras chose everything else.

Can anyone tell me why this test would be so hit and miss? (genuine question, I am not an expert photographer)

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jcmarfilph
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to Daniel Lowe, Apr 6, 2011

Nope you are PRO with your great contribution.

Daniel Lowe wrote:

Gary Hunt wrote:

I would leave the testing to the Pro's, nothing worse than home made testing it's so hit & miss.

People really don't want this cam to be any good do they :).

My test had them all on the same tripod, the same position, the same artificial lighting at night, the same subject, the same piece of white paper for custom white balance.

I had the Panasonic's on P and the HS20 was in an EXR equivalent. The cameras chose everything else.

Can anyone tell me why this test would be so hit and miss? (genuine question, I am not an expert photographer)

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Beas62
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Re: HS20 vs FZ35 & LX5. Tripod ISO tests.
In reply to jcmarfilph, Apr 6, 2011

Ditto! Thanks for the contribution.

jcmarfilph wrote:
Nope you are PRO with your great contribution.

Daniel Lowe wrote:

Gary Hunt wrote:

I would leave the testing to the Pro's, nothing worse than home made testing it's so hit & miss.

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