Noise CX3 VS CX2

Started May 8, 2010 | Discussions
schaki
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Noise CX3 VS CX2
May 8, 2010

At least a little have been made that the CX3 would be big leap over previous models.

After having compared CX2 vs the CX3. Iso 400 and 800 I fail to see any major improvement.

The CX3 carries marginally more detail if I look on the right side but desarturates the colors from iso 800 and up. Remains to be seen how well that looks after having been pulled back in PP. CX3 looks a little more grainy I think, which is good.

CX3 http://www.trustedreviews.com/digital-cameras/review/2010/02/23/Ricoh-CX3/p5

CX2 http://www.trustedreviews.com/digital-cameras/review/2009/09/28/Ricoh-CX2/p5

Corner sharpness have taken a big turn to the better, according to that review on the next page.

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Guy Parsons
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Lens variations
In reply to schaki, May 9, 2010

schaki wrote:

Corner sharpness have taken a big turn to the better, according to that review on the next page.

The lens variation in production and assembly may be the answer. My wife's first CX2 was blurred all down the right side for about 20% of the frame. Took it back and CX2 #2 was good all over the frame. Haven't done pixel peepy corner inspections yet but it looks OK. I assume that the lens assembly is the same for CX2 and CX3 and the reviewer is seeing mostly normal variations in production.

She seems to stay at ISO 200 and under and all is OK. But if CX3 offers ISO 400 with reasonable quality then that's a plus.

The question is.... will there be a CX4 in August now that the GXR has the 28-300mm equivalent module? Are Ricoh's eggs all in that one GXR basket now?

Regards.......... Guy

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schaki
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Re: Lens variations
In reply to Guy Parsons, May 9, 2010

Guy Parsons wrote:

The lens variation in production and assembly may be the answer.

Ye I was thinking that it might be sample variation but forgot to ask about that.

The question is.... will there be a CX4 in August now that the GXR has the 28-300mm equivalent module? Are Ricoh's eggs all in that one GXR basket now?

Good question. Well, not everyone is prepared to buy into the GXR only because of the P10 module. At the same time Ricoh might need some other compacts except the higher end GRDIII and the aging GX200 to offer.

CX4 might be a downscaled P10. Hard to predict exactly what it is going bring with it from the P10. I would guess: The backlit sensor (of course) aperture priority and shutter. But RAW and burst rate?
If raw, then it will certainly not be that well buffered as the P10.

Edit: I'm not in the market for a superzoom myself. But it is interesting to speculate anyway. I went to that site to see what the so called R10 'waterpaintings' at higher isos in fact was like and the couldn't resist to check some other models in the process.

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BG_DPREVIEW
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Re: Lens variations
In reply to schaki, May 10, 2010

Just red the GXR 28/300, that is about the same spec as a CX3, only RAW is extra, plus shuuter and Ap priority is new.

So they simply took existing mechancis/optics and poored it into a slider for a GXR, you bet a CX3 can record RAW in the furute,a s it is just a software extra...

So a CX4 will have to be a litle better than just the same specs as the new28/300 module, all competitors in the PxS range will have or alreday have these features by now.

(Pana can zoom in video, Casio shoots raw, sony has a gps,...)

All ricoh can do is what Ricoh separates from the rest; improve the IQ.(Oh yes off course add stereo, video optical zoom and focus, improve the IS for video,,..)

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schaki
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Re: Lens variations
In reply to BG_DPREVIEW, May 10, 2010

BG_DPREVIEW wrote:

Just red the GXR 28/300, that is about the same spec as a CX3, only RAW is extra, plus shuuter and Ap priority is new.

The CX3 don't have that backlit sensor. It should be brought in with CX4 I think.

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Pavel Kudrys
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Re: Lens variations
In reply to schaki, May 10, 2010

schaki wrote:

BG_DPREVIEW wrote:

Just red the GXR 28/300, that is about the same spec as a CX3, only RAW is extra, plus shuuter and Ap priority is new.

The CX3 don't have that backlit sensor. It should be brought in with CX4 I think.

Nope. CX3 already has backlit sensor. See the CX3 specs:
http://www.ricoh.com/r_dc/cx/cx3/

In any case, I seriously doubt there will be RAW in CX4 just because of RAW in GXR P10. But I would be more than happy to be proven wrong I just think that Ricoh will try to preserve the P10 sales by not offering RAW in CX range.

From what I saw, there is a visible difference between CX2 and CX3 in favor of CX3. However, the difference is not that big. See this comparison:
http://www.dkamera.de/testbericht/ricoh-cx3/bildqualitaet.html

On the other hand, official P10 samples looks very good for camera equipped with fingernail-sized sensor. There is a visible improvement in JPEG processing over the CX3.

Compare the level of details in these two shots (especially hair details):
CX3 300mm 1/189 f5.6
http://www.ricoh.com/r_dc/cx/cx3/img/sample_02.jpg

P10 300mm 1/90 f5.6
http://www.ricoh.com/r_dc/gxr/img/sample_08.jpg

It appears to me that Ricoh engineers dramatically reduced the level of Luminance noise reduction and so the degradation of fine details (like hairs or grass). Of course, it means more noise, which pretty evident even at ISO100. But I personally prefer noise over smeared and plastic looking images.

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BG_DPREVIEW
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Re: Lens variations
In reply to Pavel Kudrys, May 11, 2010

Hi Pavel,

i did check the 2 pics on Ricoh you posted.

I would find it very strange that a P10 28/300 performs different form the CX3.

They both have the same sensor (the CX range from Sony, both 1/2.3, 10 MP and i don't think so that Sony has 2 differnt sensor types in this format)

They both have the same optical lenses system (again, i don't think Ricoh spends lots of money in developping two identical lesnsystems with exactly the same spec, and than having one that perfomrs better than the other one).

So i can not imagine what technical detail can make a difference in making this picture?

My point is; the GXR are actually 10 differnt camera's, the CX3 is just 1 type of camera out of these 10, and i do not see why it should be worse in IQ.

The P10 can do RAW, Manal AP etc, but those are items of which i am not sure that they are substantially better, i mean, lots of others offer manaul AP, but in 2 positions, completely open or closed, and even than the difference is minimal to nothing, tested sevral myself, most of them even don't create a different DOF .

I'm sorry, but the P10 i just downgrading the GXR to a CX3, only bigger size...

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