Nikon filter question L37 and L37c

Started Jan 27, 2005 | Discussions
John_of_LA
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Nikon filter question L37 and L37c
Jan 27, 2005

Hi,

What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

Baywing
Veteran MemberPosts: 4,245
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Re: Nikon filter question L37 and L37c
In reply to John_of_LA, Jan 27, 2005

I would guess that the L37 is the original while the L37C is a later version. I would also guess that the "C" means coated. The L37C's for the last 25+ years have had the Nikon Integrated Coatings, same as the lenses.

John_of_LA wrote:

Hi,
What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used
ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

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txbonds
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Re: Nikon filter question L37 and L37c
In reply to Baywing, Jan 27, 2005

I've been told by numerous dealers that the Nikon filters are made by hoya....... is that true? I still need a few filters, and had hoped that the nikon filters contained nikon glass. Also, is the ring material brass?

Baywing wrote:
I would guess that the L37 is the original while the L37C is a
later version. I would also guess that the "C" means coated. The
L37C's for the last 25+ years have had the Nikon Integrated
Coatings, same as the lenses.

John_of_LA wrote:

Hi,
What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used
ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

-- hide signature --

'I may not know much about art, but I know what I like' John
Cleese, Monty Python
http://www.pbase.com/baywing
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Baywing
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Re: Nikon filter question L37 and L37c
In reply to txbonds, Jan 27, 2005

That seems to be a popular rumor, but I have never seen any credible evidence that it is fact. Even if it is, I think the Nikon branded filters are a cut above the Hoyas, if for nothing but the coatings. NIC is proprietary, so even IF Hoya makes the Nikon filters, they could not use Nikon's coatings on their own brand without permission, which Nikon would not likely give up. Most dealers do not stock the Nikon filters, and I'm confident that the mark-up (profit) on the Hoyas is greater than the Nikon. I've always liked the Nikon filters and found them as durable as Nikon's reputaion would suggest. I think the rings are aluminum, but I've never had a problem, they go on and come off just fine, much better than the B+W's with the brass rings which tend to lock to the lens.
My opinions, FWIW.

txbonds wrote:
I've been told by numerous dealers that the Nikon filters are made
by hoya....... is that true? I still need a few filters, and had
hoped that the nikon filters contained nikon glass. Also, is the
ring material brass?

Baywing wrote:
I would guess that the L37 is the original while the L37C is a
later version. I would also guess that the "C" means coated. The
L37C's for the last 25+ years have had the Nikon Integrated
Coatings, same as the lenses.

John_of_LA wrote:

Hi,
What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used
ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

-- hide signature --

'I may not know much about art, but I know what I like' John
Cleese, Monty Python
http://www.pbase.com/baywing
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John_of_LA
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So... no coating!? I should stay away from it then (nt)
In reply to Baywing, Jan 27, 2005

Baywing wrote:
I would guess that the L37 is the original while the L37C is a
later version. I would also guess that the "C" means coated. The
L37C's for the last 25+ years have had the Nikon Integrated
Coatings, same as the lenses.

John_of_LA wrote:

Hi,
What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used
ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

-- hide signature --

'I may not know much about art, but I know what I like' John
Cleese, Monty Python
http://www.pbase.com/baywing
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nunatak
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FWIW ...
In reply to John_of_LA, Jan 27, 2005

The L37C is a coated filter.
The L37 is not.

The L37 is, to the best of my knowledge, only available in a 52mm thread.

All my 52mm L37C's appear to be aluminum.
All of my 77mm L37C's appear to be brass.

I have used both. The L37C provides the best results.
This information can be found on Nikon's web site.

cheers ...

the born 2 design
design guy

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Surfdog
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recomendation
In reply to John_of_LA, Jan 27, 2005

As several others said, the "C" versions are coated, the plain L37's are not. Nikon makes good filters, so do Hoya & B+W and Heliopan. Iwould use a coated filter from any of these before an uncoated one from any of these. Good multicoating makes at least as much of a difference in whether there is any image degradation due to the filter as other factors.

John_of_LA wrote:

Baywing wrote:
I would guess that the L37 is the original while the L37C is a
later version. I would also guess that the "C" means coated. The
L37C's for the last 25+ years have had the Nikon Integrated
Coatings, same as the lenses.

John_of_LA wrote:

Hi,
What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used
ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

-- hide signature --

'I may not know much about art, but I know what I like' John
Cleese, Monty Python
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John_of_LA
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Thanks guys.
In reply to Surfdog, Jan 27, 2005

I lean toward 52mm L37c since I heard it's easier to clean than the Hoya. I have no doubt about Hoya quality since I use their S-HMC Pro1 version for my old E-10. I also think about a thin skylight from Hoya for the kit lens to minimize vignetting (when I stack more filter).

Surfdog wrote:
As several others said, the "C" versions are coated, the plain
L37's are not. Nikon makes good filters, so do Hoya & B+W and
Heliopan. Iwould use a coated filter from any of these before an
uncoated one from any of these. Good multicoating makes at least
as much of a difference in whether there is any image degradation
due to the filter as other factors.

John_of_LA wrote:

Baywing wrote:
I would guess that the L37 is the original while the L37C is a
later version. I would also guess that the "C" means coated. The
L37C's for the last 25+ years have had the Nikon Integrated
Coatings, same as the lenses.

John_of_LA wrote:

Hi,
What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used
ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

-- hide signature --

'I may not know much about art, but I know what I like' John
Cleese, Monty Python
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Baywing
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Re: Thanks guys.
In reply to John_of_LA, Jan 28, 2005

You should not be stacking filters unless it is absolutely necessary. Most of the thin filters are so because they remove the front threads, which makes using the lens cap almost impossible. Also, some thin filters have thinner glass, which in my mind, means they are easier to break. I don't want broken chunks of filter glass hitting my lens, so I use the regular ones, multicoated only.

John_of_LA wrote:
I lean toward 52mm L37c since I heard it's easier to clean than the
Hoya. I have no doubt about Hoya quality since I use their S-HMC
Pro1 version for my old E-10. I also think about a thin skylight
from Hoya for the kit lens to minimize vignetting (when I stack
more filter).

Surfdog wrote:
As several others said, the "C" versions are coated, the plain
L37's are not. Nikon makes good filters, so do Hoya & B+W and
Heliopan. Iwould use a coated filter from any of these before an
uncoated one from any of these. Good multicoating makes at least
as much of a difference in whether there is any image degradation
due to the filter as other factors.

John_of_LA wrote:

Baywing wrote:
I would guess that the L37 is the original while the L37C is a
later version. I would also guess that the "C" means coated. The
L37C's for the last 25+ years have had the Nikon Integrated
Coatings, same as the lenses.

John_of_LA wrote:

Hi,
What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used
ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

-- hide signature --

'I may not know much about art, but I know what I like' John
Cleese, Monty Python
http://www.pbase.com/baywing
pbase supporter

-- hide signature --

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http://www.pbase.com/baywing
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John_of_LA
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Try Hoya Pro1
In reply to Baywing, Jan 28, 2005

Hi Baywing,

I've used Hoya S-HMC Pro-1 with front thread before. I think the strength is good.

I do landscape photography a lot. So, UV filter is on there almost all the time to help reducing haze. Need to stack with some Cokin P grad to create better overall dynamic range of the scene... and sometime is just for fun effect

Thanks,
John

Baywing wrote:
You should not be stacking filters unless it is absolutely
necessary. Most of the thin filters are so because they remove the
front threads, which makes using the lens cap almost impossible.
Also, some thin filters have thinner glass, which in my mind, means
they are easier to break. I don't want broken chunks of filter
glass hitting my lens, so I use the regular ones, multicoated only.

John_of_LA wrote:
I lean toward 52mm L37c since I heard it's easier to clean than the
Hoya. I have no doubt about Hoya quality since I use their S-HMC
Pro1 version for my old E-10. I also think about a thin skylight
from Hoya for the kit lens to minimize vignetting (when I stack
more filter).

Surfdog wrote:
As several others said, the "C" versions are coated, the plain
L37's are not. Nikon makes good filters, so do Hoya & B+W and
Heliopan. Iwould use a coated filter from any of these before an
uncoated one from any of these. Good multicoating makes at least
as much of a difference in whether there is any image degradation
due to the filter as other factors.

John_of_LA wrote:

Baywing wrote:
I would guess that the L37 is the original while the L37C is a
later version. I would also guess that the "C" means coated. The
L37C's for the last 25+ years have had the Nikon Integrated
Coatings, same as the lenses.

John_of_LA wrote:

Hi,
What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used
ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

-- hide signature --

'I may not know much about art, but I know what I like' John
Cleese, Monty Python
http://www.pbase.com/baywing
pbase supporter

-- hide signature --

'I may not know much about art, but I know what I like' John
Cleese, Monty Python
http://www.pbase.com/baywing
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Bjain
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Re: L37 has no coating...???
In reply to John_of_LA, Jan 28, 2005

Whats the point, if no coating? Anyway, I have a half dozen of the L37s and occasionally use them, have not had any problems. Here is the L37 with it's coating:

Bjain

John_of_LA wrote:

Hi,
What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used
ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

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Old Ed
Senior MemberPosts: 1,749
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John: Beware misinformation here!
In reply to John_of_LA, Jan 28, 2005

You have been getting quite a bit of it.

I have numerous L37 and L37c filters. They are the
same (UV), except that the L37 is single coated
(bluish reflections) and the L37c is multi-coated
(green and violet reflections). It is absolutely
INCORRECT that the L37 is uncoated!

Both versions have their advantages. The single
coating is much easier to clean, but has "merely"
very good reflection suppression. The multi-coated
version is much harder to clean, but has excellent
reflection suppression.

Either version would probably perform very well for
you, if in good condition. My first choice would
probably be an L37c for a multi-coated lens.
But I would choose an L37 in a heartbeat over
some cheapie aftermarket brand, regardless of
coatings on the latter. (Note: B+W and Hoya
are quality filters, and I am not referring to them
with my aftermarket comment.)

John_of_LA wrote:
I lean toward 52mm L37c since I heard it's easier to clean than the
Hoya. I have no doubt about Hoya quality since I use their S-HMC
Pro1 version for my old E-10. I also think about a thin skylight
from Hoya for the kit lens to minimize vignetting (when I stack
more filter).

Surfdog wrote:
As several others said, the "C" versions are coated, the plain
L37's are not. Nikon makes good filters, so do Hoya & B+W and
Heliopan. Iwould use a coated filter from any of these before an
uncoated one from any of these. Good multicoating makes at least
as much of a difference in whether there is any image degradation
due to the filter as other factors.

John_of_LA wrote:

Baywing wrote:
I would guess that the L37 is the original while the L37C is a
later version. I would also guess that the "C" means coated. The
L37C's for the last 25+ years have had the Nikon Integrated
Coatings, same as the lenses.

John_of_LA wrote:

Hi,
What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used
ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

-- hide signature --

'I may not know much about art, but I know what I like' John
Cleese, Monty Python
http://www.pbase.com/baywing
pbase supporter

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Surfdog
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misinformation and ????
In reply to Bjain, Jan 28, 2005

I don't like to give bad information. I went and dug out a very old Nikkor lens book published by Nikon in the 1980's. It sure says that the L37 has no anti-reflective coating and that the L37C does.

I don't see any coating on Bjain's L37 (although I do see surface reflection). I see a color cast to the transmitted image that is due to the dopant used to absorb light below 370nm wavelength. The filter itself has a slight pinkish-violet tint.

The difference between a 1A and a 1B filter is the strength of absorption. Neither totally blocks blue wavelengths of light but both absorb a portion of the blue light that enters them. the 1B absorbs more than the 1A. This doesn't make the 1B better, it just depends on how much of the bluish predominance of skylight you want to absorb.

Bjain wrote:
Whats the point, if no coating? Anyway, I have a half dozen of the
L37s and occasionally use them, have not had any problems. Here is
the L37 with it's coating:

Bjain

John_of_LA wrote:

Hi,
What are the different? Does the L37 really exist? I found the used
ones on B&H and try to determine what it is.

BTW, anyone know the actual different between Skylight 1A and 1B?

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txbonds
Senior MemberPosts: 2,214
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I could swear.........
In reply to Surfdog, Jan 28, 2005

That while looking at this subject yesterday in my modern copy of the Nikon Compendium book, that it said the L37 had no coatings and that the L37c had coatings. It also indicated the L37 had been discontinued.

http://www.digitalbooks.de/nikon/compendium.htm

My version is fairly new, as it has the D70 in it. I think it was in chapter 9 that I read this. I was home sick and remembered this thread, so I was taking a look, although I don't have the book in front of me now.

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Old Ed
Senior MemberPosts: 1,749
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I don't know where this urban legend came from...
In reply to txbonds, Jan 29, 2005

But all the L37 filters I bought in the 60s and 70s were
single coated (just like my oldest Nikkor, late 60s vintage).

The coatings are easy to see--if you know what coatings
look like. Or if you DON'T know what (single) coatings look
like, you only have to compare the much lower reflections
from the surface of an L37 versus a piece of glass that really
is uncoated--like a flashlight lens.

As to reference books allegedly saying L37s are uncoated,
there could be several possible explanations: (1) reader
error, (2) translator error [e.g., meant to say no MULTI
coating], or (3) writer error [e.g., thinks no MULTI coating
is the same thing as no coating].

But Nikon did not make the error of producing uncoated
UV filters--at least not in the 35 years that I have been
buying their products.

txbonds wrote:

That while looking at this subject yesterday in my modern copy of
the Nikon Compendium book, that it said the L37 had no coatings and
that the L37c had coatings. It also indicated the L37 had been
discontinued.

http://www.digitalbooks.de/nikon/compendium.htm

My version is fairly new, as it has the D70 in it. I think it was
in chapter 9 that I read this. I was home sick and remembered this
thread, so I was taking a look, although I don't have the book in
front of me now.

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Surfdog
Senior MemberPosts: 1,080
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urban legend was started by Elvis
In reply to Old Ed, Jan 29, 2005

I hadn't expected to devote any time to this subject but, like I said earlier, I hate to be the source of bad information. I sent a note to a seasoned source within Nikon (Europe) and was told the following. Nikon used to make filters that had no antireflective coating and filters that that did, the latter were marked "C". The "C" filters were always multilayer coatings. Beginning in the '60s, Nikon began puting a single layer resin coat on optical products that were still identified as "uncoated" because they lacked the Nikon integrated coating (NIC). This trend continued gradually until just about everything had a single coating by the mid-eighties. Most Nikon lterature has continued to describe these as uncoated because they say coating** yes or no but then define "coating" as NIC.

So I'm lead to understand that an L37 may or may not have a single coating but probably does unless it's at least 30 years old. Live and learn.

Old Ed wrote:
But all the L37 filters I bought in the 60s and 70s were
single coated (just like my oldest Nikkor, late 60s vintage).

The coatings are easy to see--if you know what coatings
look like. Or if you DON'T know what (single) coatings look
like, you only have to compare the much lower reflections
from the surface of an L37 versus a piece of glass that really
is uncoated--like a flashlight lens.

As to reference books allegedly saying L37s are uncoated,
there could be several possible explanations: (1) reader
error, (2) translator error [e.g., meant to say no MULTI
coating], or (3) writer error [e.g., thinks no MULTI coating
is the same thing as no coating].

But Nikon did not make the error of producing uncoated
UV filters--at least not in the 35 years that I have been
buying their products.

txbonds wrote:

That while looking at this subject yesterday in my modern copy of
the Nikon Compendium book, that it said the L37 had no coatings and
that the L37c had coatings. It also indicated the L37 had been
discontinued.

http://www.digitalbooks.de/nikon/compendium.htm

My version is fairly new, as it has the D70 in it. I think it was
in chapter 9 that I read this. I was home sick and remembered this
thread, so I was taking a look, although I don't have the book in
front of me now.

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Alchin
Senior MemberPosts: 1,155
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Thanks for clearing this up, Surfdog. (nt)
In reply to Surfdog, Jan 29, 2005

Surfdog wrote:
I hadn't expected to devote any time to this subject but, like I
said earlier, I hate to be the source of bad information. I sent a
note to a seasoned source within Nikon (Europe) and was told the
following. Nikon used to make filters that had no antireflective
coating and filters that that did, the latter were marked "C". The
"C" filters were always multilayer coatings. Beginning in the
'60s, Nikon began puting a single layer resin coat on optical
products that were still identified as "uncoated" because they
lacked the Nikon integrated coating (NIC). This trend continued
gradually until just about everything had a single coating by the
mid-eighties. Most Nikon lterature has continued to describe these
as uncoated because they say coating** yes or no but then define
"coating" as NIC.
So I'm lead to understand that an L37 may or may not have a single
coating but probably does unless it's at least 30 years old. Live
and learn.

Old Ed wrote:
But all the L37 filters I bought in the 60s and 70s were
single coated (just like my oldest Nikkor, late 60s vintage).

The coatings are easy to see--if you know what coatings
look like. Or if you DON'T know what (single) coatings look
like, you only have to compare the much lower reflections
from the surface of an L37 versus a piece of glass that really
is uncoated--like a flashlight lens.

As to reference books allegedly saying L37s are uncoated,
there could be several possible explanations: (1) reader
error, (2) translator error [e.g., meant to say no MULTI
coating], or (3) writer error [e.g., thinks no MULTI coating
is the same thing as no coating].

But Nikon did not make the error of producing uncoated
UV filters--at least not in the 35 years that I have been
buying their products.

txbonds wrote:

That while looking at this subject yesterday in my modern copy of
the Nikon Compendium book, that it said the L37 had no coatings and
that the L37c had coatings. It also indicated the L37 had been
discontinued.

http://www.digitalbooks.de/nikon/compendium.htm

My version is fairly new, as it has the D70 in it. I think it was
in chapter 9 that I read this. I was home sick and remembered this
thread, so I was taking a look, although I don't have the book in
front of me now.

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Old Ed
Senior MemberPosts: 1,749
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I appreciate your input!
In reply to Surfdog, Jan 30, 2005

Hi Surfdog -

Thank you for your thoughtful and polite response!
I appreciate your looking into this, and perhaps we've
both picked up a few facts along the way.

I have interleaved some more detailed responses below...

Surfdog wrote:

I hadn't expected to devote any time to this subject but, like I
said earlier, I hate to be the source of bad information. I sent a
note to a seasoned source within Nikon (Europe) and was told the
following. Nikon used to make filters that had no antireflective
coating...

This could be true; but I have never seen one, in the 35 years
or so that I've been involved with Nikon equipment.

...and filters that that did, the latter were marked "C".

Did you mean to say "later" vs. "latter?". There are (single)
coated L37 filters NOT marked L37C, as you acknowledge below.
I own about 6 or 8 of them.

The
"C" filters were always multilayer coatings.

Agreed.

Beginning in the
'60s, Nikon began puting a single layer resin coat on optical
products...

I cannot vouch for the start date of the single coatings;
but my late-60s (and later) L37 filters are all single coated.

BTW, "resin" is an odd term (IMO) to describe an optical
coating, and I have never heard the word used that way
before. But if the usage is correct, then I've learned a
new one.

...that were still identified as "uncoated" because they
lacked the Nikon integrated coating (NIC).

I question this description of the reason, because the single
coating technology substantially preceeded the introduction
of NIC multicoating. Prior to that introduction, "uncoated"
meant exactly that; and "coated" meant single-coated.

Assuming that there actually were uncoated L37s early on,
I think it is much more probable that the single coating
was just treated as a running improvement, and not some-
thing that warranted a new model number.

This trend continued
gradually until just about everything had a single coating by the
mid-eighties.

My considerable collection of Nikon glass and filters was
accumulated from about 1970 on. NOTHING in the
collection is uncoated. There is one late-60s Niikkor that
is single coated. All my other Nikkors (70s and later) are
multicoated. I don't recall exactly when I bought my
last single-coated L37, but it was probably in the 70s.

Therefore, I can't see what the uncoated products
might have been that were supposedly being converted
gradually to single coating in the 70s and 80s.

But this is no biggie.

Most Nikon lterature has continued to describe these
as uncoated because they say coating** yes or no but
then define "coating" as NIC.

Yep. Knowing how marketing works, and how companies
like to hype the "latest and greatest," I can easily imagine
that they did this in their literature.

So I'm lead to understand that an L37 may or may not have a single
coating but probably does unless it's at least 30 years old. Live
and learn.

If you ever see an uncoated L37, you'll be one up on me.
But I think the odds are against it.

In closing, let me THANK you again for making the effort to
have an informative and civil discussion on this. It might
seem arcane to many, but I enjoy getting the history and
facts as correct as possible.

Best regards and happy shooting,

Ed

Old Ed wrote:
But all the L37 filters I bought in the 60s and 70s were
single coated (just like my oldest Nikkor, late 60s vintage).

The coatings are easy to see--if you know what coatings
look like. Or if you DON'T know what (single) coatings look
like, you only have to compare the much lower reflections
from the surface of an L37 versus a piece of glass that really
is uncoated--like a flashlight lens.

As to reference books allegedly saying L37s are uncoated,
there could be several possible explanations: (1) reader
error, (2) translator error [e.g., meant to say no MULTI
coating], or (3) writer error [e.g., thinks no MULTI coating
is the same thing as no coating].

But Nikon did not make the error of producing uncoated
UV filters--at least not in the 35 years that I have been
buying their products.

txbonds wrote:

That while looking at this subject yesterday in my modern copy of
the Nikon Compendium book, that it said the L37 had no coatings and
that the L37c had coatings. It also indicated the L37 had been
discontinued.

http://www.digitalbooks.de/nikon/compendium.htm

My version is fairly new, as it has the D70 in it. I think it was
in chapter 9 that I read this. I was home sick and remembered this
thread, so I was taking a look, although I don't have the book in
front of me now.

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