why not f/1.2 by Sony?

Started May 14, 2013 | Discussions thread
forpetessake
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Re: why not f/1.2 by Sony?
In reply to DtEW, May 15, 2013

DtEW wrote:

forpetessake wrote:

kcamacho11 wrote:

stan_pustylnik wrote:

Why doesn't Sony use smaller sensor surface advantage from NEX system to build f/1.2 35mm lens,  and 85mm f/1.4?

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Person is taking photos, not camera. When photograph is bad, it's because photographer doesn't know how to choose settings optimal to "own preferences". Then blames camera for bad IQ.
This is same as blaming car about arriving to wrong destination.
http://stan-pustylnik.smugmug.com

Totally unnecessary.

With the NEX cameras being so light in weight, and with their Antimotion Blur / Handhend Twilight modes where they take many exposures and combine them into one image, reducing blur and noise...a F1.2 lens is not necessary.....

F1.8 is plenty enough to be able to shoot in low light with the NEX cameras and get superb results.

Geez, the logic of the post goes like this: if I don't need something that means nobody needs it.

I've been hitting the limitation of Sony's low light capabilities all the time. Image stabilization and multi-frame stacking are just crutches not useful in many situations. To get to the same level as FF cameras, Sony should make lenses 1 stop faster. The equivalent of portrait 85/1.4 lens would be 57mm f/1.0. The equivalent of FF workhorses 24-70/2.8 and 70-200/2.8 in APS-C world are 16-47mm f/2 and 47-133mm f/2. Granted, these are not average consumer lenses, but it's really a minimum one needs for typical low light situations.

As far as I know, Sony is not planning to equip NEX line with fast lenses, it will keep positioning it as a "better P&S" for average consumer. Instead they are going to make A-mount mirrorless the flagship system with pro features and quality lenses.

Whereas kcamacho's rationale doesn't hold for anybody but himself and his own particular usage...

(And I will make the dubious brag that I'm likely the person with the longest shot-to-exposure-time ratio here in NEX-land...)

The problem is that trying to get to a FF camera's level of low-light capability with an APS-C sensor requires that we go pretty far past the point of diminishing returns in terms of lens size/cost and overall package size, to where having to live with the rest of a MILC body's compromises (focusing systems, and the limited number of controls on a small body comes to mind) makes this an exercise primarily for the committed enthusiast and/or fanatic.  That's not a very big market... and even those people at some point get tired and realize "this is stupid, I can do about as well with a cheaper lens on a bigger-sensor system".

It needs to be noted that as much as this argument applies to the NEX user seeking FF-level performance... it also applies to smaller-sensor systems upwards as well.  The forementioned Nikon 1's f/1.2 portrait prime is $900... to the end of producing a ~86mm FF FoV @ f/3.2.  Consider then, that you can pick up an EF 85mm f/1.8 for ~$300.

Every system and sensor size has its performance-to-size/cost sweet spot, which is often also its profit/volume spot.  Most systems cover that spot for themselves pretty well.  Some systems stretch farther out of that zone for various reasons, but rarely at a profit nor is ever the best bang-for-a-user's-buck.  It's often a halo product for the committed/fanatical, and sometimes the butt of jokes for others who will look at a ~86mm FF FoV @ f/3.2 for $900 and conclude that you are living so deep in your little format, you don't know which end is your lenscap.

(Just to clarify, "you" isn't the quotee, but the hypothetical buyer of such halo products.  It just does not flow with "said user".)

(It also needs to be noted that MF enthusiasts probably look at 85mm f/1.2 FF lenses with a smirk if it weren't for the fact that MF digital backs are so expensive and relatively unpopular.)

Anyways...  I'm coming to the conclusion that a hybrid system consisting of both NEX + FF bodies accessorized with their own native lenses, tied together with a focal length reducer to allow the FF lenses to do double-duty on the NEX... is the best (read: most functional and least ridiculous) solution for a photo enthusiast who values the practicality of a MILC, but requires a bigger performance envelope.  You seem to be already going that way with the Lens Turbo.

I agree, a desire to have everything in one system might not be the best approach. It's also understandable that NEX is such a lovely camera that people want everything for it.

Sony well may decide to keep NEX small with light lenses and APS-C sensor, and there may never be an E-mount FF body, they may decide to make A-mount FF mirrorless cameras, with larger bodies, and array of reworked Minolta lenses.

It's like having a laptop and desktop, neither is a substitute for the other. The efforts to make really powerful laptops weren't very successful in the marketplace just like the efforts to make tiny desktops. People learned to live with both, but not before the prices significantly dropped that they could afford them all.

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