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Re: What will be coming from Canon and when ?
In reply to jsmiller,
4 months ago
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jsmiller wrote:
Mikael Risedal wrote:
What will be coming from Canon?
The sensor from Canon is almost good as from Sony/Toshiba etc. Canon are little bit behind in QE with 50% compare to the best Toshiba 65% Sony 56%.
The DR problem starts when Canon reads out the signal from the sensor , Canon have long analog signal path way. And this shows at base iso with high read out noise, pattern noise banding and therefore 11-11,7 stops DR compared to others like Sony with 14 stops and even little more.
More Mp-when?
To use the latest APS line and make a 24x36mm sensor with the same structure as the 18Mp sensor in 7d will be expensive and time consuming because APS line will be occupied, Canon has no steppers, lenses to expose a 24x36mm area in one time with smaller geometry/scale as its needs for a new sensor tech as Sony, Toshiba, Panasonic with for example column wise ADC on-board the chip. Canon can stitch the sensors but also that is time consuming and costly
Canon has neither the whole assembly in house, the turn themeselves to Fujitsu
Compared to Sony who has 5-7 lines and down to 90nm (and even smaller) Canon has two older lines.
It is no coincidence that Canon tell us that it is enough with 20-22Mp when Canon has no equipment to go down in the scale/ geometry which is required if they are going to compete with new tech and higher resolution in larger sensors
--
Member of Swedish Photographers Association since 1984
Canon, Hasselblad, Leica,Nikon, Linhoff, Sinar
President of IARNA International anti-banding and read out noise Association
All that you say may be true. Sensor technology is continuing to evolve, and the sensors we built in our own lab showed the same improvements, sometimes dramatic, with each new generation using better equipment. Before we stopped doing this, we reached QE of above 90% throughout much of the wavelength regions of greatest interest- near UV to NIR- and read noise of below 2 electrons, approaching the ultimate of what is possible. Sensors used in consumer cameras throw away a lot of light (the color filters are one noteable place) and could be improved a fair amount more in actual performance, but they are already quite spectacular compared to film. People in the high tech industry don't like to play catch-up, but prefer to jump over what others are using in their advances. This inevetably leads to alternating between being followers and leaders (if you are good at it.) Will Canon modernize-advance- their own equipment or start buying sensors elesewhere if they feel the need to jump forward again? Are they losing customers because of their current tachnology. Of course I can't speak for others, but I recently went through a lengthy comaprison of the Nikon D800 and the Canon 5D III and picked the canon as the better camera for me inspite of the older sensor technology.
The question is how much that the difference between the "old" Canon technology from those made by Sony and others affects a photographer's ability to get the images he or she wants. If that extra stop or two of dynamic range and lower read noise is essential or important for what you do while actually taking pictures for their own sake, not for "laboratory" anaylsis, don't buy Canon. I have been unable to detect any pattern noise or banding in my last two Canon cameras. It may be there, but if it is, it's below the level of being equivalent to 2-3 detected photons, and I simply never use such low S/N images taken with my camera that this is of any significance. So the question for the buyer realy is not what technology was used for making the sensor, but is its performace satisfactory for the buyer's needs. Each buyer has to decide that individualy.
Of course all of the above is just about sensors, but there is a lot more to a camera's performance than its sensor. Considerations of ergonomics, lens quality, focus accuracy, quickness of response, etc., all are important in considering which camera to buy.
Joe
Not to mention quality control and general reliability, both areas where Canon handily bests the competition. Now that I have a remedial understanding of Mikael's post (sorry Mikael - it is hard enough for me to have a technical discussion in my own native language), the most important point for photographers is does the performance meet their expectations? My 5D III more than meets my needs. Comparing camera brands on barely discernable sensor differences or technology is a really poor way to make a brand selection. At least for me.
--
Colin Smith
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