B&H selling returned products: Question for Mr. Henry Posner

Started Jan 26, 2013 | Discussions thread
unknown member
(unknown member)
Like?
Re: FTC's position on the matter (2006)
In reply to Horshack, Jan 30, 2013

Horshack wrote:

Slider44 wrote:

Horshack wrote:

My opnion:

The letter goes on to approve Sony's plan to resell "as new" a product that was previously sold and returned but was verifiably still new, which in Sony's case included a method for verifying whether the returned electronic product had ever been turned on. Based on my interpretation of the FTC's position I believe the FTC would consider B&H's "nuanced" methods for determining whether a returned product is new or used to fall well short of what the FTC would require to allow B&H to sell a returned product as new.

Why? I just read the entire .pdf file that you linked too. You even quoted the facts perfectly. A NEW item that has been verified to still be in NEW condition can be resold as NEW. (I highlighted your own acknowledgement above).

So, how in the world do you make the determination that you feel B&H falls well short in what the FTC requires? Henry Posner has not only acknowledged how B&H handles all of their returns, but your enclosed letter verifies the legal right to sell NEW (unused items) as NEW.

Because Sony's proposal to the FTC was predicated on unambiguous, foolproof, and tamperproof methods for establishing whether the product was ever used. Sony's proposal included implementing all of the following:

"introduce reliable product packaging technologies that ensure an objective and verifiable process for identifying returned products that have never been turned on".

Do you know of any camera that has the ability to confirm it has been turned on?  So, how does this requirement affect JUST B&H Photo?

The footnote for this paragraph clarifies this as "internal chips or clocks with the ability to indicate whether a product has been turned on; and tamper-evident tape, seals, or labels affixed to AC plugs, connectors, or battery compartments"

Many of the returned used products B&H has been found to resell as new do not include these proposed mechanisms in their design or packaging (which btw is likely not an accident), and so according to Henry B&H takes a "nuanced" approach for determining whether the product is used.

OK.  Now you are making accusations.  You are claiming that B&H Photo is selling USED items as NEW above.  I have underlined that accusation.  You had better have proof of that accusation, because that comment is potentially libel.  Then you go so far as to even state this is potentially "not an accident", which insinuates intentional deception.  Is that what you are saying???

Nuanced ain't going to cut it. The FTC's position was very clear on their distinction between returned products that have never been used (and verifiably so) "inspected but not used" vs products that have been used but still "seem" new, a position which includes their disallowing retailers to modify ("refurbish") the product to look like new. Henry's "nuanced" approach would be reasonably classified as non-verifiable.

That statement was based on SONY's ability to prove the item was turned on with those built in mechanisms.  If you want to contact all camera manufacturers to build in those same mechanisms into cameras, then I am sure Henry Posner would be happy to tell you his job would be much easier to determine usage.

As far as repackaging is concerned.  I doubt you find to many retailers that have the capability of B&H Photo to repackage returns.

Finally, AS YOUR ATTACHED LETTER CLEARLY INDICATES, NEW means NEW.  If the item is NEW, (unused) the item can be resold as NEW.   I honestly have no idea what your agenda truly is, but you are barking up the wrong tree, especially in dealing with a retailer that has a 93% approval rating.

This company is highly respected by many many many members here, and customers worldwide.  They have earned that reputation.  If you do not trust them, do not buy from them.  Very simple.

-- hide signature --

Slider44

Reply   Reply with quote   Complain
Post (hide subjects)Posted by
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
(unknown member)
Keyboard shortcuts:
FForum PPrevious NNext WNext unread UUpvote SSubscribe RReply QQuote BBookmark post MMy threads
Color scheme? Blue / Yellow