This is gonna upset some of you.....

Started Nov 5, 2012 | Discussions thread
RomanJohnston
Forum ProPosts: 18,495Gear list
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Re: Please accept my apologies too.
In reply to Rick Knepper, Nov 6, 2012

Rick Knepper wrote:

RomanJohnston wrote:

Rick Knepper wrote:

xrdbear wrote:

Rick Knepper wrote:

RomanJohnston wrote:

Rick Knepper wrote:


Then post your newbie-ass BS on the crop forum where folks need the validation even if it is false. What do you [possible hope to gain from such a ridiculous comparison?

What do you hope to gain by being so unnecessarily rude?

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Brian
Fine Art Print sales of the Isle of Skye at:
http://www.eyeofskye.co.uk/

I was trying to be helpful in my first post because he does not appear to know the first thing about digital imaging and maybe you do not either. But was his repsonse to my initial post not belligerent and rude to begin with?

Here's his response (which you conveniently chose to omit):

"Oh please...I got a shot of the entire falls in my D300 as well. This is just the one I processed. This is not about crop...its about quality...any lens can be bought for either system to get the desired results."

This entire paragraph is a ridiculous statement which he will quietly distance himself from over time.

What I hope to gain? that he will think twice next time about posting a smart-ass response to me or anyone else who is trying to help him.

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Rick Knepper, photographer, non-professional, shooting for pleasure, check my profile for gear list and philosophy.

That was help? Maybe I misunderstood. I have been here helping people in the forums including this one (D2H and D2X in the past) for quite a few years. My work stands on its own two feet....

Simple point is that gear does not matter as much as so many misunderstand. I thought the output of both cameras on a scene I have recorded with a Hassy MF back (40 MP at the time), Now D800, D300, D2X, D2H, D70

Will post all that I have later....I was most interested in the MF and the D800 comparison that I will post soon. These just happened to be the first ones I processed. So will provide more later.

My apologies if I seemed a bit snarky .

Roman

Yes, that was help. You cannot make a reasoned argument from the two images posted without defining what it is you consider "compelling" and you haven't done that so far.

Here is some more advice that I hope you do not take the wrong way. You are obviously well known in this forum so maybe others who know you filled in the blanks from knowing where you stand on the many topics that abound in this forum. I do not know you so I could only assume from the text presented, rightly or wrongly, that these mis-matched photos were evidence that you have a ways to go in understanding the benefits of high resolution and digital imaging. The point being that you forced an assumption.

When posting to a forum with tens of thousands of participants, to avoid misunderstanding, it is advisable to be as explicit as possible, in this case, defining the term "compelling results". First thing I learned in English Composition (or the first thing that made an impression on me at least) was never to make assumptions about what your readers know. Also, using the DPR profile to list your current and previous equipment and possibly a short bio might have influenced my initial response (though understanding digital imaging doesn't require one to ever have picked up a camera). Being a great communicator with images doesn't necessarily spill over to the written word (not that I am implying anything about your general skill with written composition).

Equipment does matter. For example, I do not see many Leica M9s in the hands of professionals at sporting events. The weapon of choice for landscape is MF. Etc etc. When MF format in digital form becomes affordable for me, I will bid farewell to 135. It's okay to use a D300 to shoot landscape but it is less than productive for anyone to delude themselves that that camera is can do what a D800 can do technically and operationally.

So, let me see if I understand the OP now. Let's say Roman is shooting a porno scene with the D300 and D800, I probably would not be offended by having to look at the D300-produced images. In fact, there may even be some advantage with it's reach and all though a nice, juicy crop from a D800 file might offer more resolution. Bottom-line being that my first reaction to such photos would not be about IQ. Is this on track?

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Rick Knepper, photographer, non-professional, shooting for pleasure, check my profile for gear list and philosophy.

LOL...I like your sense of humor. I am the proponent of sensible truths. People say you cant print 40" x 60" from 12MP and it be any good. My customers and my peers who live in the area (including the local pro shop who hangs my work in the past) all seem to think otherwise. People get caught up in the math instead of trying it. They try to prove I cant do it or dismiss me as a fool, but my customers say they not only love my work, they say they feel like they can "just walk right into it".

D5100 and D300 D7000....ect...are very capable landscape cameras with the two newer ones having great resolution and dynamic range. Not to mention that DX has an amazing (if not better) assortment of super wide lenses available. So the average person with a couple grand in their pocket looking to get into landscape work would benefit by buying say.....a D7000, cheaper but very capable lenses, a tripod, cable release...etc....and investing the rest in workshops, classes, travel, or even joining a local group. I guarantee you the end result will be better pictures than a guy buying a D800, no tripod, no investment in self. (you would be surprised how many people were walking around the dark gardens this weekend....hand held with a D800...walking up to a scene....pointing the camera and walking on to the next thing that interested them.)

Point is we have a long way to go to get away from the better camera = better pictures mentality. You do need to consider that of the maybe hundred or so people that participate in each forum ....their are HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS that come here...but stay in the background. So just because the hundred or so actually GET IT......there truly are so many that do not. To this day the first question I usually get is..."what camera do you shoot with"? Or I over hear.....at showings "he must have an amazing camera". I know that sounds like its right out of the jokes we say from time to time here in the fourms..but often humor is how we express our truths...is it not?

Bottom line if I went out with a D7000 and a D800, my end result should and will be, that I would come back with great work from both. Up to 30" x 45"....both should give me prints that I can market...then bigger than that the D800 should walk away from the D7000. This does not mean that I don’t understand that even in 16" x 24" prints I wouldn’t be able to see the difference between both cameras (especially side by side) but both would be VERY marketable.

I will get the D800 because I want the most from my work for my customers. I specialize in very large prints and want to give my customers the most I can for the money they spend. So the upgrade is inevitable. Been working on the hassy file in prep for a new thread and I have yet to do a direct comparison, but even at 40 MP vs 36, the hassy seems to have the edge.

When I can afford to go MF...I will still probably do so as my work and equipment evolves.

Whew...that was long winded. I totally understand why you responded like you did....but hey...this is how we hash things out....this is how relationships are forged. No harm.....no foul. Nice to meet you.

Roman

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The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious; It is the source of all true art and science.
~ Albert Einstein
http://www.commercialfineart.com/
http://www.pbase.com/romansphotos/

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